How would you handle this?? My boys are 10 and 8, they are very close. There is a 9 year old boy that lives in the neighborhood. All three of them played a lot together last summer(he moved in right before that). After school started my youngest started making comments about how the neighbor only wanted to be friends with my oldest ds. I asked him how this made him feel. He said it was okay, he had lots of other friends. We have always talked a lot about how everyone isn't going to like you. Soon after this, my oldest came home upset because the neighbor had made a big deal about oldest not sitting with my youngest ds on the bus, and instead sitting with neighbor and his friend. They sit 3 in a sit. So, my ds ditched his brother to move. But, after he did this, the neighbor ditched my oldest to sit with two of his freinds. Therefore my oldest ended up sitting by himself. My youngest had found other kids to sit with. I told my oldest it was his fault. He was ugly to his brother, because of this boy, and it came back and bit him. As the year moved on this neighbor started being pretty rude to my youngest, just making comments about him being stupid, etc. I told my oldest, that it was not okay to sit by and listen/watch this neighbor be ugly to his brother. He needed to tell him to cut it out. My youngest also did/does a good job of handling it. I told my oldest if he wants to be friends with the neighbor it is fine, but he is not going to talk to youngest that way, and be mean to him. Youngest didn't/doesn't seem to care about this boy one way or another. Well, for the last few months oldest hasn't wanted to play with this boy either, says he is just tired of how he acts. Well, we have been at the pool a few times in the last couple of weeks, when the neighbor has been there with his family. The boys have all gotten along fine. Well, today, the neighbor asked if the boys could play. They both wanted to, so I suggested he come over here. I wanted to keep an eye on things. Well, once again my oldest and this boy started ganging up on younger ds. My youngest handled it fine, and I stayed out of it because he is going to run into this again, and he needs to learn how to handle it. Nothing got out of hand, I just didn't really like the tone this boy and oldest were using with younger ds.

I am just so disappointed in my oldest ds. It just seems with this boy, he is so quick to turn on his brother. He doesn't act this way any other time, or with any of his other friends. To be honest, I really like all his friends, but I am not too thrilled with this boy. I have talked to oldest over and over about how to treat people. We have talked about this boy. Oldest has said he doesn't really like how he acts most of the time, he is mouthy, etc.

What would you do in this situation. If this boy doesn't want to hang out with youngest ds, I don't care, and I don't think he does either. My boys are not a package deal. But, to be honest, I am starting to realize that this boy likes to include my youngest when wanting to play, he seems to get a kick out of being mean to him, and turning oldest ds against him.

So, what should I do??

By Amecmom on Thursday, July 3, 2008 - 09:18 pm:

Wow - tough situation. You don't want the older one to feel he can't have his "own" friends, but you don't want them double teaming the younger one.
The rule of playdates for toddlers and young children is two or four, but not three, because two usually end up teaming up and the one left is odd kid out. I didn't realize that it doesn't end with toddlerhood .
I think you are right on when you say you think the older enjoys tormenting the younger one. If you can, make sure your younger son has another friend over when this boy is over, or see if you can't make sure he's not around the older two.
Did older ds get it that this boy likes hurting his younger brother? If so, maybe that will be enough to keep older ds away from the neighbor.
Good luck,
Ame

By Yjja123 on Thursday, July 3, 2008 - 10:01 pm:

I had a similar situation, though the "friends" were actually relatives. As a group they would gang up on my daughter with my son standing by. He didn't participate but he didn't help the situation either.
I sat down with my nephews and told them that they wouldn't like being treated that way and I would not tolerate them treating my daughter that way.
Then I sat down with my son. I told him that his sister is his flesh and blood, yes his cousins are too but.... and he is to respect her and defend her. She would (and has) done the same for him. I told him that watching people bully someone and not doing anything is cowardly. If he did not speak up and tell them that he did not like it, he would be in trouble.
It was quite a while before there was another incident. My son did speak up and the cousins promptly apologized and everyone went back to playing.
You may not be able to get the boy to listen to you but I would tell him he cannot be disrespectful to your son/s if he wants to play with them. Your son should be told that he should not stand by and watch your younger son be bullyed.

By Pamt on Thursday, July 3, 2008 - 11:36 pm:

It is tough. I would just keep a watch on it, keep talking to both DSs (esp. the oldest), absolutely insist that the oldest isn't ganging up on the youngest, and I bet the oldest will realize that he's a pawn and being "used" and figure it all out on his own.

By Debbie on Friday, July 4, 2008 - 12:00 am:

Thanks for the suggestions. I did talk to oldest tonight about it. He got defensive, with him that means he knows he was wrong. I called him on it, and he said yes he knew neighbor wasn't treating youngest very well. I once again told him I expected him to speak up, not go along with it!!

The weird thing, is last summer they played together a lot, probably 3-4 times a week. All three got along great, never any fighting, etc. I don't know what happened once school started. My oldest ds said he thinks the neighbor was getting picked on at school. He is very small. My youngest is 1/2 a head taller then him. I don't know why the change in his behavior/attitude. I used to really like him, and enjoyed having him over. Oh well.

By Ginny~moderator on Friday, July 4, 2008 - 09:21 am:

It sounds to me like the neighbor kid has been the target of bullies and he is trying to pass it on by bullying your younger son and persuading/manipulating your older son to join in the bullying, as PamT suggests above. And trying to drive a wedge between your two sons (the incident on the bus). You can't control what this other boy does away from your house, but you can continue to drive home to your older boy that bullying, for whatever reason, is not acceptable behavior. And bullying his brother in order to please the neighbor boy is particularly unacceptable.

I don't know that it helps much to put your older son on the defensive - as you noted, that makes him defensive of his own behavior and, by extension, the other boy's behavior. I think the only thing you can do is show both offending boys that actions have consequences by taking action whenever you observe any bullying - sending the neighbor boy home and sending your older boy to his room or some other consequence. But in the long run, your older son is going to have to figure out for himself that the other boy is using and manipulating your son in order to make himself feel superior to your younger son (and probably superior to your older son by being able to manipulate him), and you can't really speed up that process. But putting him in the position of defending himself and, by extension, the neighbor boy can make the process take longer because he won't evaluate the relationship while he is defending it.

By Debbie on Friday, July 4, 2008 - 10:37 am:

Thanks Ginny, I agree with you 100%. Also, I think this boy is jealous of the realtionship my two boys have. He has 2 brothers that want nothing to do with him.

I talked to dh, and thought about this a lot last night. I am going to just send this boy home if I witness the behavior again. I already talked to oldest about it this morning. I am also not going to let youngest play at his house, I will have one of his friends over if oldest wants to go over there.

Also, I will say, that the boys mom always says something/disciplines him if she sees any type of this behavior, which is good.

By Ginny~moderator on Friday, July 4, 2008 - 11:12 am:

Debbie, it's great that the boy's mom is aware of the situation and is trying to manage it. It does sound like this boy has "self esteem" problems (I don't much like that phrase but it seems appropriate here). That may stem from him having been a victim of bullying during the past school year. Is there some way to address the bullying issue for the coming school year? Are the teachers aware of it? A boy who is smaller than most is usually a target, sad to say (my youngest was in that position for quite a while, and his behavior altered negatively as a result - wish I'd been aware of it then and tried to cope with it). Is there some way to help this boy learn how to cope with verbal bullying so that he doesn't feel that he has to "pass it on" to another victim?

By the way, congratulations to you on the way your younger son is handling this. Sounds like a boy who has his act together and has benefited from good parenting.

By Debbie on Friday, July 4, 2008 - 11:41 am:

Ginny, I know his mom is aware that there have been issues at school. She has told me that she is concerned that her son has become very mouthy, and she feels it is a result of these issues. I know he got hit in the stomach once, and she ended up at school. Hopefully, since she is aware of it, she is taking steps to handle it.

Thank you for the comment on my youngest. He is such a joy. Very confident in himself. My oldest is just so laid back. He seems to just go with the flow. I wish he would stand up more when he knows something isn't right. He just tends to want to blend in, which worries me at times. We just keep working with him on it.

By Debbie on Friday, July 4, 2008 - 11:42 am:

Oh...and I have noticed he has been extra sweet to his brother this morning. I think he just doesn't want to make waves, but then he does feel guilty after the fact.

By Ginny~moderator on Friday, July 4, 2008 - 05:49 pm:

Debbie, my middle son wanted very much to be liked by everyone, and I was very concerned about peer pressure and what wanting to be liked might lead him to. It wasn't until he was about 16 that something happened that relieved my worries, when he made it clear that his own image of himself was more important than what his friends thought, but it was a somewhat traumatic event for him. I think you are doing the right thing, helping him to see what is the right way to behave but at the same time not cutting him off from this other boy. Maybe eventually he will chose to try to help this boy change his ways, but that has to be your son's decision. In the meantime, I can only say that no one ever said that parenting is easy. I can say that for all the frustration and heartaches and upsets I had with my sons, they all grew up to be very nice people, they all like me, and I like them (which is different from loving them, as we all know). But it was often a difficult road, and I don't know any way to make it easier for anyone else except to say that you know what is right - and hang in there.