Marriage issues
Moms View Message Board: General Discussion: Archive January 2008:
Marriage issues
Have you ever thought that perhaps your life would be happier if you were in a different situation? My DH and I are going through some major issues right now. I have a hard time even looking at him, I am just so angry all the time. We haven't had sex since October. I feel no closeness to him. He is a good man, a great father and he does have my best interest at heart I think. We are in a very tough bind right now. Depression has been a constant issue and he is on medication although he stopped taking it for several months b/c he was concerned about drug testing for a position he wanted. He is back on it now.
I was just wondering if anyone else has ever felt this way and if, in time, this feeling will pass.
I have mostly been happy in my marriage. However in the past 16 years there have been times that I wondered, if this really was it, could I be happier elsewhere. What I can say is this doesn't just pass. It takes a commitement and a decision that you aren't going to settle for this. You cannot change your dh, but you can change how he affects you. These are the times that communication becomes important. You tell him what you are feeling and that you think him and you and your marriage are worth working on and then get on a plan to do so.
I think there are times divorce is the right choice, but I don't think unhappiness is one of those times.
But if you do nothing things will only get worse. So you owe it to yourself to make changes and to your kids to show them that when the going gets rough you get off your bum and find a solution.
For example, you don't find him desirable, you don't have sex. Well, that needs to change. Sex is an important part of marriage. Tell this to your husband, is it neither of you are in the mood? My suggestion, plan some dates and schedule some sex. Have some wine and forget about all the hurt feelings, etc and remember the good things about him.
Your marriage didn't fall apart in a day, it will take time to heal it, but it will take a decided effort to do so.
We've been married for 20 years, and I am happy. While we do have our squabbles, we can always get close again. I can't imagine any other family and living anywhere else!
I can't say I've ever felt that my life would be happier in a different situation. (Marriage-wise). We've been married 10 years in March, together 16 in April. The times I've felt "unhappy" have been over a particular incident or situation that occurred. It's communicated (and that's not always in a nicey-nice way, LOL!) and it gets resolved. Yes, over the years of marriage there are going to be hurt feelings, let downs, times when you don't feel as connected. It's during those times that you make an effort together. After our biggest blowouts or what might seem like a bad specific situation that we're in for whatever reason, Dh and I always connect on one thing - we'd rather be in it together than anywhere else. I'm a very happily married woman.  Having said that though, I personally believe that marriage is COMPLETELY unnatural and we are going against the grain just by doing it. Staying with, loving, being in-love, and standing by a companion for a lifetime is difficult because it's unnatural. That's just my personal opinion. I think a lot of people get divorced because it's so hard to do. People change so much from point A to point B. You do still have to be happy with the changes your spouse makes over time, and that's not always the case.
I do think that people get divorced because of unhappiness and they should at times. BUT, I think that it should only come to a divorce when all that unhappiness has been communicated, heard, and worked on together. If all those things have been done and ample time has passed for resolution and improvement, then the "unhappy" person has to really look at their life and ask themselves what they want out of it.
Kaye gave good advice. If you're not interested in sex, find out why. Why don't you feel close? Find out why if you don't already know. It takes two. Good luck.
Anon, I don't know how long you've been married, but long enough to have children. As a woman who left her husband and raised three sons as a single parent, after 19 years of marriage, I can tell you a couple of things. First, you really should do everything you can to work at making your marriage work. I do not regret my choice, because my husband was not willing to work at making the marriage work, but just expected that it would work as long as he wanted us to stay married. But I can tell you that living as a single parent is very, very hard. It's hard financially, it's hard emotionally, and it is awfully, awfully lonely. You say your husband is a good man and a good father, and that is worth holding on to if you can, together, make the marriage work.
Second, I don't think a bad marriage - bad for whatever reason, and a non-working marriage is not a good marriage - should be held together for the sake of the children. That is a terrible burden to put on children. My dear dil had that experience. She lived through years of her parents battling with each other, to the point where she sometimes starts trembling when she hears raised voices or angry words. Her parents started their divorce within a couple of months after my dil and son married, telling her "we only stayed together until you got married". That has been a major burden to her. Whatever burdens my sons have for having lived through their parents' separation and being raised by a single mom - and yes, there have been burdens and I can still see the results of them - at least they are not burdened with my living in constant unhappiness for their sake.
Third, living with a person who suffers from serious depression is very difficult. My youngest son, who has major problems with depression, has been living with me for almost 4 years, and though he is my son and not my husband, I can tell you that there have been many times when I have become depressed, frustrated and angry because of his depression. There were many times when we were just two people living in the same house and being courteous to each other, rather than having the closeness of mother and son. We would barely see or speak to each other, as he came home and went up to his rooms and I stayed in my part of the house, as if we were boarders in the same house. Fortunately for both of us, a couple of years ago my son finally decided to actually accept that depression is a fact of life for him and he couldn't just ignore it or wish it away, and he began to actively fight his depression, began weekly counseling with a very good counselor, learned how to identify what was happening with him and begin counter-measures when he started getting depressed, and got on top of things. Over two years he went from taking three major medications to a maintenance dose of one anti-depressant, and a bit over 2 months ago his psychiatrist took him off even that medication, and he is fine. Yes, he will always be a person who has depressive tendencies, and he will have to watch his mental health carefully - and he does. But now he is a fun person to have around.
So what am I saying? I am saying that if you and your husband will both get into serious counseling because you both want to work at making your marriage work, you have a chance of making your marriage work. And this may involve separate counseling also for your husband for his depression. Given that he deliberately took himself off his medication for job related reasons - a very bad move - I am guessing that he is not willing to accept that depression is a medical fact of his life much as diabetes or asthma (both chronic conditions) would be. So there is every chance that he is not willing to face up to the problems with his mental health and the problems with your marriage and seek counseling. If that is the case, I strongly urge you to seek individual counseling for yourself, to explore with professional help just what you want and what you want to do with your life. I am firmly convinced that professional counseling is a very important tool for anyone thinking about making such a major life-changing decision as the possibility of ending a marriage. I think you are so caught up with your daily unhappiness that you cannot step back and take a really good look at yourself, your life, and what you really want. This is where a good counselor can really help. It won't be easy or fast, whether you go to counseling together or you go by yourself. One of the very uncomfortable things about counseling, if you take it seriously, is that you are forced to look at all those things you've been hiding in a mental closet, and you've been hiding them for the very good reason that it hurts to think about them. My experience personally with counseling, and watching others, is that the first few months are very painful and it is hard to stick with it - but almost always worth it in the long run. It can be a long process, especially with serious depression in the mix, but it is almost always worth the effort.
You have my sympathy, my concern, and my prayers.
Oh, and to answer one of your questions. Every marriage runs into bad times. Every marriage has to be worked at, almost constantly, to stay a real marriage. And there is no guarantee of happiness - certainly no guarantee of always being happy. Sometimes the bad times can be very long - months or even a year - but if the couple is willing to work at the marriage, remembering why they got married and remembering the times when it is a good marriage, most of the time the bad patch can be gotten through. But it takes hard work, from both parties. It takes two people to be married and it takes two people to stay married.
Others have touched on many points I would also make, so I just want to touch on the no sex since October part.
I know that I "feel" the closest to dh when our sex life is in active mode. LOL I think most couples go through times of less sex, for many different reasons. It is during those times that I don't feel as connected to dh. I have even been the one to inniciate things during slow times. Not always because I want to, but just to get things moving again if that makes sense. The closer you feel, the more you "want" to have sex and that part seems to work itself out. I am not saying that if you start having sex again, all things will be resolved.
I also think you need to really think about why you are so angry at him. What is the root of that? Did this all start when he went off his meds?
I have been with my DH a total of almost 20 years and there have been many ups & downs. I will say that there have been periods of time where we did not have sex a lot but that, I have noticed it comes and goes too. A lot of counselors say that an active sex life is a sign of a good marriage. I disagree to a point. While it is important, it is not the be all end all of a marriage, IMO. My DH & I are true friends. I know that if I should I fall sick and not be able to take care of myself, he will not be the type of man that runs off, he will stay with me and take care of me and the family. If I were to leave him, all that would be gone, and if I were to leave him for another man, there's no telling if he would be that kind of man. Marriage tends to go through different seasons, and it sounds like you are going through a dry season. I suffer from depression and I really feel bad sometimes because I feel like a burden to my family when I get real down. Maybe he feels that way too. Just a thought.
It seems logical to me, Anon, that if both you and dh have problems with depression, both of you need some psychological counseling, and possibly some marriage counseling. I understand what Vicki is saying, but my own feeling is that if you don't have an emotional desire to be close, having physical closeness can feel very phony and sort of either using or being used. It's not what I would do. But, I am not the only person to judge by.
Yes, struggling with depression can feel like a burden to you, and you can feel like a burden. That is certainly how my son felt. I can only tell you that with the help of lengthy and sound psychological counseling, he was finally able to get a handle on his depression, recognize it when it was descending on him, and fight back - so far pretty successfully. I won't say that he will always be able to fight back or that he won't have depressive periods. Heck, my problems with depression have been much, much milder than his, and I still have spells where depression takes over until I finally decide to take back control, and it isn't easy to either decide or to take back control. But, most of the time it can be done, with the help of counseling, medication maybe if appropriate (and it is often appropriate, certainly in the early stages of fighting back), and developing understanding of what is happening and what to do.
I'm sure your husband also feels like a burden when he is depressed, and if you are both in depressive spells at the same time it must be truly awful and very, very lonely. I do urge you both into counseling, and I hope very much you can both find ways to deal with this, separately and together.
Just an update. DH is going to counselling tomorrow. He has promised me that he will not alter his medication anymore. He applied on a job that he was worried might do a blood test and didn't want it to show up so he thought it would be best to go off the meds. Also, this time of year always seems worse.
I had an appointment arranged for this week with a counsellor through my work but it has had to be rescheduled.
To answer some of your questions:
1. We haven't had sex because I am so tired all the time. Also, DH isn't as attractive to me as he once was. I'm sure I'm not as attractive to him as I once was either.
2. I am angry b/c of a situation he has put us in. He is without work now and I feel a huge weight on my shoulders to hold the family together.
Thanks for all the advice. I will read this through many times over the next week or so.
I would also suggest counseling...or at the very least, reading a good marriage book together and discussing it or going on a marriage retreat together. Yes, marriage (and sex) has cycles. Sometimes you feel more in love and connected than at other times. That's totally normal. However I think it is important to remember that love isn't a feeling. Love and marriage involve work. Ultimately it comes down to a commitment. After the honeymoon phase and when your DH leaves the toilet seat up, doesn't pick up dirty socks, and doesn't make "wooing" you a priority...and when you stop trying to look your best for him, begin to nag, and maybe even mother him...that's when you both start the real work of marriage. That means communicating about needs, wants, and dreams. It means making time alone together a priority---and not spending it talking about the kids. It means not letting the little irritating things get to you and it means trying to "outdo" each other in acts of love. Marriage is not 50/50. It requires each person to give 100%.
Also, about the sex issue. I think it is crucial to remember that men think about sex very differently that most of us women do. While it is intimate and we feel connected to our DHs, for them sex=love. If your DH is depressed and/or anti-depressants, both of those things can decrease his libido. However, his need for love is not diminished. I agree with what Vicki posted. I know when we go through those periodic low sex rut that we just kind of get out of the habit. I have definitely learned that "sex begets sex," meaning the more we have sex the more that I want to have sex.
You also need to deal with your anger. Are you mad at him or is he just the recipient of your anger?
Here are some books I would recommend:
His Needs, Her Needs
The Five Love Languages
A Celebration of Sex
Anon, we were posting at the same time. In light of your recent post...Kudos to you both for getting some counseling. If you aren't having sex because you are tired I would suggest that you start going to bed earlier to be better rested and make a commitment to sex at least once a week. Start from that and see what happens. And heaven help us, we all gain a little weight, things shift, wrinkles happen and it will only get worse. Think about the things in his character that you love and focus on those. Also, a huge part (see His Needs, Her Needs) of a man's self-esteem comes from his work and providing from his family. This is likely exacerbating his depression. You really need to let go of your anger and focus on the good things--great friend, great father, etc.
Hugs!
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