Discipline Help
Moms View Message Board: General Discussion: Archive March 2004:
Discipline Help
It's a good thing my first grader is at school right now, because I am HOT! We've had had ongoing issues about cleaning his room, taking care of his stuff, etc. We go one step forward and two steps back it seems. I don't expect his room to be immaculate. I do expect dirty clothes in the hamper, clean clothes in drawers, some semblance of order, and an attempt--sloppy as it may be--at making his bed each morning. Here's the thing..he does make up his bed and after several reminders he cleans his room. When I ask if he room is clean I then follow it with "are you sure you aren't just hiding it?" I do this because he has a habit of hiding toys in other places and hiding dirty clothes too. Honestly he spends more time looking for new and creative hiding places than it would take to put the stuff where it belongs.
I just washed sheets and went to put them on his bed. While in there I thought I pick up a few out of place things just to be nice. As I go to put a ball in his toybox I found 2 school uniform sweatshirts, a pair of dirty socks, two other shirts, the pair of khakis he wore to church yesterday, and a pair of shorts. Pieces to board games and their instructions were all over the place in his closet. He honestly doesn't just have tons of toys because we have majorly decluttered, but the ones he does have (bey blades, bionicles, legos, games) are in pieces-parts everywhere! AAARRGGHH!! I really don't expect his room to be in perfect order--he is a 7 y/o boy after all. But it is the LYING saying he did what I asked and the hiding (which is a form of lying) that just get me so aggravated.
We've tried natural consequences (no clean socks because you didn't put them in the hamper? you'll have to wear dirty ones---he doesn't care), taking toys away, time alone in his room, loss of privileges, etc. And we've tried rewards and always try to catch him doing good. Just last night he cleared off the glasses from the table without being asked and I made a big deal of praising him for it. I just called DH at work because I was so mad and we've decided this for now. I am taking ALL of the toys out of his room and he will have to earn them back. He will also have to spend the afternoon in his room alone with no toys and he can't listen to the radio or CDs. His books will remain in there for now, but they will be taken out if not put back without reminding. He has a huge bookshelf with tons of books--too hard to get out and I don't want to put him in total solitary confinement.
The parts of Noah's personality that get him into trouble are also the parts that are so lovable. He is very passionate about life, very affectionate, always on the go, flits from one thing to the next. However, because he is so busy he'll start doing one thing and get easily side-tracked. He is VERY social and even when we take away computer or GameCube he will have almost as much fun watching someone else play and cheering them on. When you are upset with him it takes him awhile to realize that you are REALLY upset (we know when we get tears that he finally understands) and then 5 minutes later he is full of hugs and telling us how much he loves us. If I get this child raised 'til 18 I will have achieved sainthood. Any thoughts, advice, or commiseration welcomed!
I just wish you good luck!
What you are doing sounds good. I heard about toy "jail", it's like what you are doing, They have to do extra choirs around the house for a point or quarter then they can "bail" one toy out for each point our quarter but if it is left in the floor again if goes back to jail.
My first thought: Beyblades HURT when you step on them! Worse than Legos! OUCH!!! 
I wish I had great advice for you, but I've been nagging my kids to clean their rooms for a couple of weeks and it's still a mess. You could help him clean up and organize the room, but I'm not sure how much that would help (it didn't work too well for me). There is always a star chart with specific chores on it. Once he gets an agreed upon amount of stars, he gets a treat. We've had some success with that, especially since they sometimes view it as a competition. Is he into basketball? Maybe a basketball hoop over the hamper will encourage him to pick up his dirty clothes. Who hasn't tossed something into a basket and yelled "2 points!" I don't know. I wish I had better advice. Would you settle for for my empathy?
Before my kids leave for school, their beds are made and their room is clean. And I don't tell them to do it. Not once. And they reached this point with absolutely no stress on my part.
My kids room will be clean every day. This can happen in two ways. The first is they can do it before school. The second is I can do it after they leave. The benefit of them doing it is they keep their stuff.
After they leave for school I go in with a bag and collect anything not put away. Then it goes into my closet where it will sit until I feel they can handle having it back. If their beds are not made, I strip them and neatly fold the sheets and blankets. They can then make their beds before bedtime.
When they come home from school I say nothing about their room. They know if their stuff is gone where it went. It is very rare for them to actually get upset over anything I have taken. And I did have to strip my six year old's bed quite a few times before he remembered to make it in the morning. But in the end is was worth it. It is very rare for me to have to strip their beds or confiscate any stuff.
Just remember, less words and more action. My kids get no reminders in the morning. They don't need it. Either they remember or something happens that will make their lives just a little bit uncomfortable. And that gets them thinking. The more thinking they are doing, the more learning they are doing.
Good luck! I hope you find a method that works for you!
Pam, I think it is a great idea to take away those things that he doesn't pick up and then make him earn them back. I do this with my ds who is in kindergarten. He is in charge of picking up his room each morning. He doesn't have many toys in there because we have a playroom, so it is pretty easy to do. I no longer ask him to clean his room. He has learned that if he doesn't pick up, then I will do it when he is at school. Everything I pick up I take and he has to earn back by doing extra chores. Does your ds have a hamper in his room??? I put one with a lid in my ds's room. When I do laundry, I just ask him to bring it down. I found this much more effective then having a hamper someplace else.
I had to laugh at your description of your ds. He sounds just like my youngest. I just got back from the grocery store with him. He ran off from me and got in trouble. The minute I got done talking to him, he wanted a big hug. Just like your ds, he is the king of wanting hugs and kisses after he has gotten into trouble.
Well i do the same thing with my dd. She doesn't seem to care though anymore. Her room looks like hurricanes have swept through there on a daily basis. I take it all away and she just sits downstairs and bugs me all night, i send her to her room to sit and she seems okay with that. It drives me NUTS!! I have done charts and allowance and punishments and i just can't find that ONE thing that gets to her. I like the idea though of having her bail out her toys with allowance, LOL. That would bug her! Unless she decides to just buy new toys! That would be my luck!
I actually think this might be part of his personality as you said. He's only seven, so his personality is still emerging, but he may never be a neat freak. My son's room sounds pretty similar, but I don't really care that much (I'm not neat either- so how can I get upset with him). You should see my desk at work! BUT....I do know where everything is and if anyone touches my desk-they're dead! I guess I just don't see this as a big deal. Maybe it's just cause we have bigger fish to fry with my son..... Does it effect anything else in his life? (is he missing assignments, not completing work, losing library books?) I personally think the throwing things/taking things away is a bit harsh. Perhaps teaching him an organizational system and then holding him accountable for that (in small increments) might work. Maybe start with the games. Then say, "I expect all game pieces to be put in their proper boxes." Watch how he does with this for awhile and then move on to Legos. All I know is I spent a lot of time cleaning my room as a child, and resenting my mother all the while, and it didn't really "help" me as an adult (except that I don't go crazy if my kids' rooms are messy!)LOL! That is unless I'm trying to vacuum!
Okay, I am going to try what Melanie suggested with my ds. Melanie, what age is a good age to start this at? I have a 4 year old, a 2 year old that I would like to start this with. I just don't know if it would work with the 2 year old. I know it will work with the 4 year old because he is already required to keep his room clean and the playroom clean, and he does a nice job of it. But, he has to be told. I want him to start doing it on his own.
Another problem I have is my 2 year old will destroy the playroom and sometimes my 4 year old's room. Who cleans it then?
Pam, I am sort of dealing with the same thing as you. I tend to like Melanie's idea, so I'll second her here.
Hi Amy! I am glad you liked the technique!
Generally speaking, this kind of thing isn't recommended until a child is Kindergarten age. However, if you think it is something that would be effective on your four year old, then by all means try it!
As for your two year old, I definitely would not try this. I am going to go out on a limb here and say keep doing what you are doing. Based on the fact that you have the expectation of your four year old to clean up after himself, my guess is you currently work with your two year old to pick his things up. Make it fun. And when you tell him it's clean up time say, "I'll help!" It's so sweet to see a little two year old who sees Mom or Dad doing a chore and have him chime in, "I'll help!" LOL.
I certainly wouldn't have your four year old clean up your two year olds mess. You don't want any feelings of resentment to build up between the two over something like that. I would simply help the two year old myself.
Also, if you see your four year old cleaning up his toys without being asked, do the "I'll help" thing with him, too. If he sees you do that, he will do it back to you sometime. Kids always repeat what they hear us say. It's nice when it's nice words like "I'll help".
Still waiting for my L&L books to arrive. I'm anxious to get them!
Robin, I can't wait to hear what you think!
Well, my little prisoner is in his room. He was a bit dumbfounded to find all of his toys missing, but he went directly to give me his papers from school and feed the cat (which are 2 of his afterschool responsibilities) without a word. He even offered to take out the trash for me--LOL. I've told him for each day that his bed is made and his room is picked up that he can earn 1 toy back. If it is not done, then he loses whatever is laying around. I will not be reminding him.
As to the other suggestions---charts don't work. We have already decluttered and organized his room to a T when we redecorated it in December. We took everything out of his room and only put back the good stuff (and only so much of that) and it was all well organized in his walk-in closet. His room is very small anyway, so most of his stuff is in his closet. As for, letting it slide..it's not just a cleanliness issue. It is an obedience, stewardship, honesty issue. I am not a neat freak and any visit to my house would quickly clue you in to that. I was raised with a mom anal about cleanliness, so I have somewhat rebelled against that. However, I do expect dirty clothes to be put in the proper place to get washed and to be able to vacuum and dust without rearranging the whole room. I'll let you know how it goes tomorrow. The trick is if I have to strip his bed, it is hard to make up from scratch even for me since it is a daybed.  I'll keep you all posted. Thanks for all of the ideas!
Debbie, aren't these type of kids the most exasperating, fun, and frustrating to raise?! One of my best friends says that Noah is "a party waiting to happen."
LOL Pam, I love that description! I always say about my Griffin that life is just a party. I like your saying better!
I think having a hard bed to make is actually a good motivator. Alec has the top bunk. I've had to strip his bed one time and one time only. LOL.
Good luck! I hope tomorrow goes well for you!
Good luck Pam. I hope this works for you. I tell you what, Josh really keeps us on our toes. I don't know what we would do without him. He is definitely the "life" of our household. He is great, but a challenge. Dh always tells me (in private, of course) that we were lucky to have him last. Otherwise, we would have only had 1 child.
I think you would like Lisa Whelchel's book 'Creative Correction'.
|
Members
