My DD was thrown to the floor yesterday by a boy in her class. He was "playing Superman." My DD was one of 3 children that he did this to yesterday but she was the only one hurt enough to go to the nurses office.(The teacher was busy disciplining another child and didn't see this occur.) I have seen this boy act out constantly when I volunteer in the class. At a birthday party (the whole class was invited so that no one felt left out) he made 2 little girls cry by being too physical with them and when he did the same thing a boy, the boy warned him that if he did it again he was going to get decked. The boy's parents stood by during the whole party and did almost nothing to correct his behavior. They seem to have a very hands-off approach to disciplining this child. I have heard a lot from other parents who knew this boy in preschool and he has only gotten worse over the past 3 years.

My DH was so mad yesterday that he wanted to immediately call the school and have a meeting with teacher,principal and the boys parents. I calmed him down but I'm not sure what our options are in regards to this matter. I don't want to go crazy about it but I also feel it shouldn't be dropped. As far as I know, this boy had not been tested for ADHD, which it sure seems to me he has(impulse control issues). What would you do??

By Colette on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 05:39 am:

I would call the school today and let your dh be furious. If this is a constant in the classroom the child should either be assigned a one on one aide or removed from the classroom. Due to budget issues, it may take parents complaining for this to happen. This is not normal behavior.

By Mommyduncan on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 07:27 am:

I agree with Colette, let your dh call and be furious. It sounds like this child is just an accident waiting to happen. What if he threw a child up against a table hard or an a concrete floor? The "What if's" are endless here.

I substitue a lot and if I ever had a child in my room that behaved like this, he would be sent to the prinicpal's office everyday. A teacher can not properly teach her class if this type of behavior is going!

I hope you dd is okay.

By Texannie on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 08:03 am:

I agree with them also. You and your dh have every right to be angry.

By Kaye on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 08:52 am:

How old of a child are we dealing with here? If it a kindergartner then I think you need to back off. My son is that kid, it isn't that I have a hands off method of disciplining him, he just doesn't always get it. We know he is tough, we know he makes made decisions, we know he is not quite right. What exactly do you expect parents to do in a classroom situation during a party? I certainly have removed my son, his teacher doesn't approve of that, it is her classroom. You never know when he is going to do something in appropriate, the teacher doesn't, the kids don't, I certainly don't. I am not saying that you shouldn't mention it to the teacher, but certainly more than angry maybe you should consider some sympathy for these parents instead of the judgemental attitude. It is exhausting dealing with a child who does not fit into societies mold, they are more than likely doing the best they can.

By Texannie on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 09:03 am:

I don't think she should judge the parent or even talk to them, BUT imho, she does have the right to make sure that her child's safety is guarranteed.

By Kittycat_26 on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 09:04 am:

Sorry, Kaye but I disagree with you about backing off. Yes, kids will be kids and sometimes when they are younger, play is rough. I am saying this from the point of, I have a 20 month old who has bitten so hard that he has broken skin on the other child. This being said, kids have a right to be safe at school and it starts at kindergarten and younger.

Parents have every right to be angry that their child was "thrown to the floor." It is the job of the principal to ultimately ensure that the children within his school are safe from both outside and inside persons. If the teacher was busy disciplining another child long enough that this child had time to throw not one, not two, but three children, then there is a problem.

Whether that problem stems from the child, the teacher, or just the set up of the room is not the issue of Annon. Her/His problem is that their child was not safe in school that day. This is unacceptable and good reason to be angry and vocal.

By Vicki on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 09:26 am:

I also agree that this should not be backed off of. I understand your view point Kaye as you are the parent of the child that causes the concern, but there is no way this should be going on in any classroom K or not! I can also say that if it were my child that would have been thrown to the floor, I would have been at the school yesterday!! If I threw my child to the floor, I would be turned into child services! No way I would accept that another child did it as kids being kids or that this child just doesn't get it. Sorry, but if a child threw my child to the floor (not to mention the same things to two other kids) I would make sure he got it real quick that this wouldn't happen again and I wouldn't rest until the school did something to teach that lesson. There is no way a child should be in harms way at school. It sounds as if this teacher has way to much to handle in this class if she can't watch some kids because she is dealing with the behavior of other kids. I would seariously question who is in control of this class!

By Anonymous on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 09:29 am:

Original Anon again.

We are talking about a kindergartener. And normal kid play that sometimes gets a little rough is not a problem for me at all. This situation is a bit different though.

I am in no way judging the parents here. I was merely explaining that they do not discipline him when he does something wrong. The birthday party wasn't at school. It was a party thrown at a kid's play place. The parents definitely should have stepped in at that function but they did not. They watched it and did nothing. Many of the parents at the party were upset by the lack of control.

By Debbie on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 10:10 am:

I think you definitely need to talk to the teacher and or principal. My oldest ds is in kindergarten. His school has a very strict policy about kids not touching other kids. The first few weeks of school my ds got in trouble for touching other children. Not hitting, but just having his hands on them. At first, I thought they were being a little harsh. However, after talking with his teacher, I see where they are coming from. They simply will not tolerate it because of what it can lead too. They feel that they must get the message across to them in kindergarten. I will say that my ds now keeps his hands to himself at school and at home.

I definitely don't think we should judge the parents. We don't really know what goes on in their home. Some kids can be a handful even with proper discipline. My youngest is this way. However, it is still not acceptable and I don't think you should back off. Something needs to be done before someone gets seriously hurt. If one of these children had hit their head hard on the floor, they could have really gotten hurt.

I also wanted to say that I can definitely relate. My youngest ds had a little boy in his preschool class last year. He was constantly hitting, yelling and basically being horrible to everyone. Finally, it got to the point where my ds did not want to go to school. I had to talk with his teacher. I found out that I was not the only parent with a child having issues with him. They eventually removed him from the class. I really felt terrible for the little boy. However, it was not fair that my ds was scared to go to school because of him.

By Mommyathome on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 10:45 am:

I agree, talk to the principal, teacher, parents, whatever it takes. You shouldn't compromise your childs safety so that you can protect someone elses child who may or may not have underlying issues.
It's best to get this taken care of before something more serious happens IMO. If he is doing this in kindergarten, what will he be doing in third grade?
Don't let it go....let your DH call if he would like to. At the very least it should be on the record that this stuff is occuring.
Good luck!

By Colette on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 12:55 pm:

Let us know how it works out. I don't agree with backing off. I work with these kids. The school needs to contact the parents and let them know there is a problem with the child. The parents need to realize they need to ask for help for their child. It's not just going to stop if no one does anything about it. It's the school's job to protect the children and if this is a constant behavior they need to put a stop to it. A lot of kids like this benefit tremendously from a one on one aide/esp/para-professional (whatever term your district uses), the aide is with the child for the whole day and can recognize triggers or diffuse the situation before the child explodes.

By Mommmie on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 01:37 pm:

The school may not be able to do anything until parents start to complain. Maybe they need the paper trial in order to get help for this child. Or maybe the parents are trying to get the school to help their child, like get an evaluation done, and the school is saying no bec they evals are expensive.

Certainly the incident should be formally documented with the school.

We had one of these aggressive kids in my son's public school. We all loved his mother, she was a dear, but this child was out of control. The other moms tried to help by arranging closely supervised play dates, but ultimately the other boys just didn't want anything to do with him. The parents refuse to "drug" their child even though he has an ADHD dx. So what can you do? Another mom said to me, That boy is just going to be THAT kid and that's just the way it is. His parents are shopping around for a private school now for next year, 4th grade.

Full disclosre - my son is dx ADHD and takes medication for it.

By Kaye on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 02:23 pm:

I guess my view point is very different. I don't see this child's behavior as "agressive" from this one post. I think we are making a lot of assumptions on his behavior because one child got hurt. Aggressive to me means it is intentional. Yep he probably did intend to tackle your daughter, but I highly doubt he threw her down with force as much as he kind of shoved her out of the way. Way different in my book. My son has no DX, has no help from the school, he is active, touchy and yes sometimes touches when he shouldn't. This isn't because the teacher doesn't remind him constantly, or me, not because he hasn't been to the office because of it. Anytime a child gets hurt at school a paper trail is made, from the nurse if nothing else. I also agree this kid is a handful, some just aren't. There doesn't have to be anything wrong with them to act this way, some just do. I wish ADHD were an answer for us, we would use the drugs, I HATE the looks i get from parents when my child touches their kid and their kid doesn't like it. Our altercations go like this, my child touches kidb shoulder, kid b touches back, my child then hugs your child, kid b hugs back, then it becomes a bigger hug, sometimes they even fall on the floor, wrestling before it is said and done. And even sometimes kids have bumped their heads. This isn't aggressive, it isn't okay by me either, we are working on it. But in this situation from above "he made 2 little girls cry by being too physical with them and when he did the same thing a boy, the boy warned him that if he did it again he was going to get decked." What is too physical. Mine gets too physical, he is a touchy and in your face, I can't think of kids crying because of it, but I am sure they have, as much as my kid loves to touch there are children on the other extreme. But hey one kid threatened this boy, and we aren't angry with him! I see that as an issue. Plain and simple, let go of the hate and anger, we in know way have any clue what the whole picture is. Just because he is this way in K, does NOT mean he will not learn more socially acceptable behavior later in life. By all means comment to the teacher, the principal whatever makes you feel better. I am very close to this situation. Unfortunataly we don't all have those sweet children who follow directions most of the time. From one post those I refuse to hang the parents for doing a bad job, label the kid with a medical DX or even condemn him to a life of misery and punishment. Children in kindergarten come in all ranges of maturity. Even docs will tell you they do not like to dx adhd in children 5 and under unless there are SEVERE issues. Boys especially mature a little later. I know in my sons classroom, he is not the only child who is having issues, I don't walk in there a single time and there not be at least one issue of so and so pushed so and so, or the likes. I am in there 3 times a week 2 hours a day, I am well aware of how a kinder class room runs, stuff happens ALL day. I am sorry your child got hurt, I am also certain that the mom of this boy is too. If she knows, and likely this incident didn't get passed on to her, I can say she probably is struggling too, should I call an dapologize, my gosh I wish MY son didn't do this, etc. So on her behalf I apoligize!

By Texannie on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 02:51 pm:

This statement....
My DD was thrown to the floor yesterday by a boy in her class. He was "playing Superman." My DD was one of 3 children that he did this to yesterday but she was the only one hurt enough to go to the nurses office......"

and this question.....
"What would you do?? ....."

was the only thing I was basing my advice on. If my child was hurt by another child, badly enough to go to the nurse, I would talk to the teacher and principal about my concerns for her safety.

By Marg on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 03:24 pm:

If the child was hurt enough to go to the nurse's office weren't the kids questioned on what happened?

Just curious.

Everyone should be contacted. No one is going to be looked down on, but something needs to be done if this is a constant with this little boy.

Dh is a behavior specialist. If your school has them, there is a possibility he is a candidate for one. Dh is supposed to work one on one with kids like this that can be aggressive and does not perceive it that way. They can be hurtful to themselves and others, this is why it is called a behavior specialist. An individual would actually go around with the child everywhere and if they thought the behavior was getting out of hand they pull the child aside and talk them through it. It is really unique and dh is really good at it.

These people may also be called TSS - Therapeutic Support Staff.

This child my be just physical and does not realize he is hurting others. It is difficult for everyone involved but there are caring individuals who can work with these kids.

But EVERYONE needs notified, or it may keep happening

By Marg on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 03:28 pm:

Also a reminder, these children at that age get labeled "bullies" if something can be done to make a change in their behavior without drugs or being nasty to them, it should be done.

Just my $.02.

By Yjja123 on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 03:37 pm:

As a parent who just pulled my son from public school (due to the lack of response from the school and my son being constantly bullied) I can only say--
Do not let this situation go without stating to the school that this is unacceptable behaviour and you will not tolerate your child being subjected to it!
Your childs safety has to be the most important issue.

By Anonymous on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 04:28 pm:

Kaye,
I have no "hate" in this whole situation. If my DD had been treated as you say your son treats other students I probably wouldn't have too much of a problem with it. MY DD has been taught that if she doesn't like the way anyone is touching her, she is to ask them to stop. That's how I imagine a situation like that would be resolved. This problem is very different.

Yes, my DD was forcefully thrown to the ground by this child. She has the marks on her arm. He didn't push her or trip her. He also forcefully threw 2 other kids, both boys, to the ground in the exact same manner. One of the boys was hurt but didn't tell the teacher. I know this because his mother showed up at school this morning when I was leaving. She came to speak to the teacher about why her son was thrown on the floor. The teacher was quite stunned that we showed up and were both concerned. Her comment was "maybe I should talk to his mother." Well, yeah, she should but she didn't. The mother was there this afternoon and not a word was said. When I saw that nothing was done about this situation, I informed the teacher that if this boy put his hands on my DD again, we would be going over her head to the principal and/or superintendent.

While I was in the class this afternoon I saw this boy intentionally hit a girl in the eye with a spoon. She cried and was sent to the nurses office. I watched the whole incident and this girl did nothing at all to provoke his behavior. As I stated in my first post, I believe this boy has impulse control problems.

By Kim on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 06:43 pm:

I kinda agree with Kaye. This problem is between the teacher, the child that has the problem the parent of that child. I mean that is where the main course of action should be. I am not even gonna write a long one on this. I work with kids in a daycare. And I also have kids like this.

Whatever happens, I hope it gets worked out.

By Anonymous on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 10:43 pm:

Kaye,
My son has acted inappropriately at a party before and you know what, he left.....right then and there. Was he embarrassed? Yes, but he will never do it again. My son is very strong willed and could have been this boy if we hadn't responded to every inappropriate act, than goodness we have really tired ourselves with disciplining him. Yes there were times when we both felt that was all we did but to let it go is unfair to him (no one would want to be around such a brat). His teacher has even said what a great roll model he is to the other kids and how polite and well behaved he is. He also knows that if he misbehaves at school that his teacher can call me anytime, my husband or myself will leave work or whatever we are doing to come handle the situation. If isn't the teachers place to correct a child...that is up to the parents.

I would go to the principal without a doubt, not just for the safety and security of the other children in the class but for the boy himself. He needs to learn what is acceptable behavior and his parents need to be made aware that there is a serious problem.

By Bobbie on Thursday, February 26, 2004 - 11:59 pm:

I am going to keep my opinions on the whole mentally/emotionally unstable child issue to myself because I can write a huge book on the issue and the long term effects of not getting proper treatment but I suggest you go to the office tomorrow and speak to the principal. Something needs to be done and it is his job to make sure it is done. I would try to remain calm at this point and tell him that you just wanted to make sure he understood the actions of the child and that it wasn't an isolated situation and then see where he takes it from there. But try to stay calm.

By Kaye on Friday, February 27, 2004 - 09:10 am:

Anon number 2. First let me state that your use of anon is inappropriate in my opinion. I am reading by your post that you have parented in such a way that your child has become a great role model...good for you. Me too! I have two other children who are great kids and make great choices. I also have Andrew. Love him dearly, parent him strongly, he is a bit off...sad but true. I certainly don't quit parenting him, but do hope people give me a little grace with his behavior. I do remove him from many a situation, but simple put his problem does NOT stem from poor parenting, but different wiring. Yes he gets all the help he can, but it still doesn't "fix" him. And guess what we still love him. Anyway, if this sounds harsh, it is, I certainly don't appreciate the undertones of you are such a better parent than I am, maybe I took that wrong, but when you post anon to bash me, I feel that can be taken no other way.

Anon 1...obviously your second post shows a lot of very bad behaviors. I dont' think impulse control is as much of a concern as physical aggression. Talking to the teacher was the right thing to do. No child should leave scholl with marks on their body.

Okay I am finished posting here.

By Bobbie on Friday, February 27, 2004 - 09:24 am:

Kaye the use of anon was wrong in the second persons post you are correct. But things like this happen. Do not take it personally. And no one here walks in your shoes or knows what you have or have not done in the care of your son. We are emotional people with opinions that range from a world of different experiences and I am sure everyone on here could give an opinion on the way any one of us have raised our children. Good kids or ones that are viewed out of control. We all are just doing what we know to do.