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Moms View Message Board: The Kitchen Table (Debating Board): This is not a debate, but I'm looking for information.....
Jehova Witness......what exactly makes them who they are? How do they differ from Christian?
Dana,
Wow, I didn't know that. All I knew was The Watchtower and people knocking on my door on some Saturdays. I think the JW observe Saturday as their holy day, and I believe they have some dietary restrictions. By and large, JW is a very strict faith.
Further question: (again not a debate, just curious)
I think the definition of "cult" is anything unorthodox. But, who is to say what is unorthodox? What is completely normal to one person may not be to another. People who were born and brought up believing in voodoo, santaria, scientology, etc. would never believe they were unorthodox. So, when it comes to religion, who knows?
Dana, I emailed you the answers to these questions. Out of respect for your request not to debate here, there is no way to answer your questions (for me) without causing a debate.
Thanks, I'll look for it. It hasn't gotten here yet.
Dana, I think some of it has to do with size, and some with longevity.
Thanks Ginny. Boy this stuff can get confusing, can't it?
According to Jehovah's Witness' theology, God is a single person, not a Trinity, who does not know all things and is not everywhere. He first created Michael the Archangel through whom He created all "other things," including the universe, the earth, Adam and Eve, etc. This creative work took God 42,000 years. At one point, The Watchtower Bible and Tract Society taught that God ruled the universe from somewhere in the Pleiades star system. They have since modified this to say that the "Pleiades can no longer be considered the center of the universe and it would be unwise for us to try to fix God's throne as being at a particular spot in the universe."1 Such changes and even contradictions in teaching are frequent in the Watchtower organization and when a doctrine changes, they tell their followers that the light of truth is getting brighter. After Adam sinned, the paradise which God had created for them, was ruined. So, God instituted a system of redemption which was revealed in the Bible and would ultimately lead to the crucifixion of Jesus the messiah. But, in the meantime, God needed to have a visible, theocratic organization on earth to accurately represent Him. Throughout history, this true organization had a remnant of faithful Jehovah's Witnesses (Noah, Abraham, Moses, David, etc.) but it wasn't until the late 1800's that Charles Taze Russell formerly began what is now known as the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society which is run out of Brooklyn, New York. This organization claims to be the only true channel of God's truth on earth today and that it alone can properly interpret God's word since it is the angel directed, prophet of God on earth. When it came time for the savior to be born, Michael the Archangel became a human, in the form of Jesus. Jesus grew and kept all the laws of God and never sinned. Finally, when Jesus died, it was not on a cross, but on a torture stake, where he bore the sins of mankind -- but this did not include Adam's sins. Jesus rose from the dead as a spirit, not physically (his body was dissolved and taken by God) and during his visitations to people on earth, he manifested a temporary physical body for them to see and touch. Thus began the true Christian church of Jehovah's followers. Throughout history there have been faithful Jehovah's witnesses who have managed to keep The Truth in spite of the "demonic" doctrine of Trinitarianism that has permeated the Christian church in "Christendom." Christendom is filled with pastors who are antichrists, in churches run by Satan, and who support the earthly governments which are all of the devil. In other words, all of Christianity is false and only the Jehovah's Witness "theocratic" organization lead by several men in Brooklyn, New York, is true. In the late 1800's, a young man of 18 years, by the name of Charles Taze Russell, organized a Bible class in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. In 1879 he sought to popularize his ideas on doctrine so he co-published The Herald of the Morning magazine with its founder, N. H. Barbour and by 1884 Russell controlled the publication and renamed it The Watchtower Announcing Jehovah's Kingdom, and founded Zion's Watch Tower Tract Society (now known as the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society). Russell served as the teacher and guide for the organization which taught that Jesus returned invisibly in 1914 and is now reigning in heaven. When Jesus finally returns physical to earth, which will happen at the time of the Battle of Armageddon, He will set up his earthly 1000 year kingdom. During this 1000 year period, people will be resurrected and have a second chance to receive eternal salvation by following the principles of Jehovah's Organization on earth known as the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society. After the millennium, those who reject God and His organization will be annihilated; that is, they will cease to exist. The rest of the Jehovah's Witness who have faithfully followed God's organization on earth will be saved from eternal annihilation and reside forever on Paradise earth. Heaven, however, is a place for a special group of 144,000 Jehovah's Witnesses -- the only ones who are "born again" and who alone are allowed to take communion in their annual communion service. When you study with the Jehovah's Witness, you agree to attend five meetings a week where you are taught from Watchtower literature. You cannot be baptized until you have studied their material for at least six months and have answered numerous questions before a panel of elders. Men are not supposed have long hair or wear beards and women are to dress in modest apparel. They refuse to vote, salute the flag, sing the "Star Spangled Banner, celebrate birthdays or Christmas, won't take blood transfusions, and they can't join the armed forces. A schedule of door-to-door canvassing is required where you distribute the Watchtower literature, acquire donations, and forward all monies to the headquarters in Brooklyn, New York. If you ever leave the Jehovah's Witness organization, you are considered an apostate and are to be shunned.
Bea, wow. What great information.
I don't know about voting or holidays, but I know that many people are members of faiths that consider it a religious violation to show certain acts which we consider respect for government or leaders, or respect for national symbols, and I believe the JWs, among others, participate as little as possible in what they deem to be government activities (voting, etc.) because they view God as the head and no government or elected individual is important in that context. Quakers, for example, would not take their hats off for the king because the king was just a man like every other man; nor do they take an oath in any proceeding - you know, hand on the Bible, I swear to tell the whole truth, etc. - but rather, state simply, without the Bible, that they will tell the truth, because all persons are always required to tell the truth and taking an oath is not assurance that a liar will not swear - I think there is also a component that it is unGodly to take God's name as a witness to your intent to tell the truth. As for the flag, I believe JWs and others consider it something of an idol and saluting it to be akin to worship. They are not alone in their desire to be "separate" - in Pennsylvania and a few other states, the Amish are not required to send their children to school beyond, I believe, 8th grade - they do not want their children exposed to secular teaching; they also do not take oaths, do not generally register to vote, and follow many practices similar to the Quakers with respect to secular government. The Amish are not part of the Social Security system and generally do not believe in insurance, believing that God and the community will care for those who need help. There are also some very strict Protestant groups that don't celebrate Christmas, seeing it as just another day in the calendar - that was the practice of the Puritans in England and in New England; I imagine they would view birthdays in general and holidays in general the same way.
Hmmmm, I'll have to print this out to read it more carefully.
Typically a cult is a group that deviates from the mainstream religious belief. There can be Christian cults, Muslim cults, etc. A cult has 3 things:
Pamt, I think the definition you posted is accurate and concise. What does your husband's studies say about cults that survive the death of the highly charismatic leader (i.e., Mormons)?
Dana,
I got the email. Thanks. And Pam, I would love to discuss this further...and anyone else who is interested. Perhaps we can find a time to all get together. I have a chat room that we can use.
Dana, I'd be interested if you set up a chat. Let me know at klipvm@rcn.com. As it happens, I am on "vacation" next week (planning to do my annual spring cleaning to catch up on all the stuff I have ignored during my usual SAD - winter seasonal depression).
I am very interested in this chat. I must say (and hope I'm allowed, since this is on the debating board) that I am scared of Jehovah's Witnesses, and Mormons. I don't mean to offend anyone by it, I just worry about anyone who comes to my door trying to push their beliefs on me. I also think that the leaders and teachings of those groups, and other groups that are pushy and judgemental, are a bit outlandish. This is just my opinion on the religion, not on the members themselves. I'm sure not all of the members of the religions are as overzealous as the founders and devout followers. Like I said, I'm just weary of anyone pushing something on me, especially at my own doorstep. I agree with Ginny... to each his own, but they don't seem to feel like that.
I'll be trying to do some cleaning and catching up too next week. So perhaps the week after Easter.
Hey I want in on the chat too
Regarding cults:
I think another sign of a cult is finances - does the religious oranization encourage or expect you to turn over all or the bulk of your assets, or to tithe or contribute as you see fit. Everything I've read about cults says that they want their members to turn over all of their assets, paychecks, whatever.
One of the reasons the mormons and jw come to the door is because good works are very important and only a few people get into heaven. So they have to work really hard to earn a place in heaven!
What a very interesting discussion.
This has been a very interesting post..I read everything and much of it I didn't know..I also agree that cults are usually run by someone who is charamistic(sp?),prey on the weak and confused and in the end abuse the love their followers have for them.I find this very scary..
Hi everyone! Glad to have gotten a such a wide response on my curiosity.
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