Preschool Woes
Moms View Message Board: Parenting Discussion: Archive July-December 2004:
Preschool Woes
Brendan is three and a half and started daycare/preschool in June. We've been having some issues at school with him not wanting to do his "work" when the other kids are, his teacher says he will say "he's tired" or just lay his head down while the other kids are doing their color sheets and working on the letter of the week.
This week is "F" we've gone through ABCDand E and he's just not doing his work like he should. She's started sending his papers home for us to work with him and we've been working on then at home. He really has NO interest in this at all... I'm not sure how to handle this, I hate that he's this young and already not wanting or liking school. I do think part of it's that he's not sure that he CAN do it.
Tonight we went through his paper and I ended up with 2 decent "f's", but it was like pulling teeth.
He's also holding his pencil with a death grip with his fist. Any hints on getting him to hold it the right way or is it alright that he's not?
Tomorrow I'm going to make some sort of incentive chart for him and I'll have this on there as well as some other things...
Thanks for any input, I'm at a loss...
I teach 4 year old preschool- not sure I can help much, but here goes.
We don't start writing ABC's til January. I stick with numbers til then. I think 3 and a half is young to starting ABC's yet- but that is just my opinion.
Sometimes boys move slower than girls. Or at least I find that the case sometimes.
What I would do would be to make a deal with him for now. Say - if he does his work well all week he can rent a movie or something. Give a sticker everyday and then at the end of the week let him pick something out of a treasure box as a reward.
Holding the pencil is tough. Holding his hand to it like it should be held is a good way to start. Tell him to just pinch the end of it. Also, I dot my letters to start off with and let them trace them awhile first.
Mostly remember he is just three.
Good luck.
JMHO, but as a former preschool teacher and mother myself, I think this preschool is too academically focused and expecting too much! At this rate your DS is going to begin to hate school. Is there any way to change schools and put him in a more developmentally focused one? {{{HUGS}}}
Ditto Trina. 3 y/os should not be learning to write and learn letters. They should be coloring, painting, playing with play-doh, building with blocks, playing in centers, etc. I would strongly suggest a "developmentally appropriate" preschool (DAP) program that allows children to grow and explore at their own rate w/o focusing academics. Reading to children and circle time are great as well as some alphabet-letter awareness, but children this age aren't ready and shouldn't be ready for such academic stuff.
This was my son exactly - lack of interest and avoidance in pre-reading skills and the death grip. Keep an eye out for dyslexia. Not saying he is, but just keep it in the back of your head for when he hits PK4 and kindergarten.
My first indication there was a problem was from his PK3 teacher. He had just turned 3. I just blew off the teacher's comments that she was concerned about his avoidance and lack of interest. I thought to myself, They are too academic, he's too young, boys are slower to get with the program, she's a girls teacher. They weren't particularly academic, but regular kids have an interest in playing school, pretending to write (scribble), having fun with letters, recognizing their names, coloring and my son wanted none of it.
There are early warning signs of learning disabilities. Can he copy a circle? Can he dress himself? Can he get himself a cup of water? Can he make a tower of blocks? Can he ride a tricyle? Can he hold a fork properly?
I agree that the expectations seem high at this preschool. My 3yo is barely able to draw recognizable shapes. I can't imagine the intricacies of letters.
With regards to the pincer grasp on his pencil, there is a great slide-on pencil grip available at school supply stores called (get this!) "The Pencil Grip"!!! You can find them here: http://www.pencilgrip.com/inside.pencilgrip.html
They are very easy to use and my ds and dd have learned the correct way to hold a pencil with it. My ds was having a really hard time with it and we had worked for about a year on it (he's 5yo) with no progress until we got a few of these. He has one at home, one at school, and one at therapy. DD started stealing his at home and learned how to hold a pencil way ahead of schedule. I hope you are able to find and try these. I think they are amazing. I work in a school supply store and we have about 10 different grips and this is the easiest and most comfortable. It even comes in different glittery colors. DS liked the blue and red glitter. HTH
One other idea...I would bribe my ds to do his best work on worksheets. For every letter written to the best of his ability, he would get a gummy worm. I knew that he could do it but he was in too much of a rush. I gradually faded out the reinforcer because I don't like the idea of bribing my kids with food but it encouraged him enough to learn how to make the letters correctly. Most of his frustration was that he didn't do it as well as he wanted and so why bother trying? All the practice for gummy worms made him so much better that he was happy with his work and didn't mind writing after that. Again, HTH
Christy...do you think he is just tired because he has been sick? I know that he was really starting to enjoy going to preschool.
Can he copy a circle? Can he dress himself? Can he get himself a cup of water? Can he make a tower of blocks? Can he ride a tricyle? Can he hold a fork properly?
He can copy a circle and fully dress himself, he could get the water if I let him  he just recently got a peddle tricycle so we're learning with that and the fork he holds correctly...
From what you said I don't think that's the problem with Brendan, he loves to color and can recognize most numbers and alot of letters, his lack of wanting to try is usually when it comes to writing. He can draw a circle, square, and triangle its letters that get him.
I am going tomorrow to a teacher supply store that I used to work at and I KNOW they have those pencil grips so I'm going to pick one up. I'm wondering if he should be using the fat pencils or the thin ones?
As for the work being done at his school, it's not an all day focused on academics. It's partial days and you add to the fact he's only there 3 days a week and that could be part of the problem... He's very bright, he can count to twenty in english and to 10 in spanish and loves to be read to. He can recognize his name and I know several kids that are four and can write thier names so I don't think they are to hard on them.
He does get the playtime, arttime, and circle time but with kids having to already know so much BEFORE going to school I felt that he needed some extra help along the way. I don't want him to start school and be behind or not know what he should know before starting. That is why I choose this particular school with this program...
You may have something there Emily, he has been sick alot.
Wow! My DD is 3 1/2 and just started Preschool this Summer and they are not doing anything to do with the alphabet that I know of. (Although, I really did not want an academic fosused preschool)She recognizes some letters, but she is definately not writing them.This is the schedule for this week:
Week of Oct. 4th-"Signs of Fall" Leaves, leaves everywhere-we will rake them, sort them, compare them to pine needles. Our art will revolve around fall colors. We will read RED LEAF YELLOW LEAF and FRESH FALL LEAVES, and we will learn the songs "Fall Leaves" and "The Month of October." Weather permitting, we will take a nature walk to collect leaves.
I hope he feels better soon.
My first child was a visual learner, so we did a lot of videos, worksheets and books.
My second child (who is 4) is a "touchy feely" learner, she likes to be able to TOUCH things. So, I use big colorful blocks to teach her simple addition and subtraction and she really enjoys that. She also LOVES to help out in the kitchen and to do household stuff, like dusting, etc.
She knows and recognizes all her letters of the alphabet and she knows all her "at" words (cat hat fat sat, etc.) and all her "it" words (hit, sit, fit, etc.) She is learning these by "edible art". Usually different kinds of uncooked pasta, ribbons, bowties, macaroni, etc. Some folks put food coloring on them, but I do not. I take some construction paper and draw a very large letter on it and then we take liquid elmer's glue and trace the letter and then she puts the macaroni on the letter. She learned all of her letters and words this way. And dry pasta is easy to just "sweep up" when she's done.
We have also used playdoh, I "roll them out" with her into a long, skinny string and then I call out the letter and she makes it on the table with the playdoh.
This morning she counted to 100 (by herself) in the car on the way back from taking "big sis" to school so I am pretty sure we are on the right track.
If your son is a "touchy feely" learner and not a visual learner, he may resist writing and visual concepts to learning, you might try things he can touch and hold his hand as home reinforcements.
(blocks, playdoh, pasta, etc)
Good Luck
AJ
My youngest was not interested at all in writing letters, etc when he was 3. He was 4 back in July and he is just now taking an interest in it. Now, my oldest was writing the full alphabet and his name at 4. They are just totally different. I will say that my youngest is really learing at a fast pace now that he is interested. He is in preschool 3 days a week and they are not writing their letters yet, the teacher starts this the 2nd half of the year. They are working on letter recognition and the sounds they make. They do a lot more interactive things instead of sitting and doing worksheets. In fact, I don't think they do any worksheets. Now, my oldest was in a very academic preschool, but he thrived there. He was interested and ready at an earlier age.
It could be a lot of things. I know he has been sick lately, that could be it. Is he really active?? My youngest is and I have found that I have to use different approaches when I try and teach him things. He is thriving in his preschool which is more interactive. I actually taught him his numbers at the grocery store using the isle signs. He is learning the alphabet with an alphabet puzzle. However, he does not do well sitting and writing letters. He looses interest quickly.
Audrey-I love the pasta idea! I'm going to try that. Sounds like fun.
MY ds did not do well in preschool when he was 3-1/2. And they didnt even do alot of academics. I pulled him out for the spring and summer ( for a couple of reasons). This Fall I found a new school that offers a shorter school day (3hrs a day mon-thur) and has very, very, experienced certified teachers only. This Fall he is like a completely different child. He loves to go to his school and he has learned so much in such a short time that my dh and I are just *amazed*.
He is 4-1/2 and does not hold his pencil perfectly, he colors but is not completely in the lines, some days he tries to make his letters and some days he doesnt try as hard. But his teacher has *never* made a big deal out of it or sent *homework* home with him. They are always praising him and telling him (and me) what a pleasure he is. We will not send him to Kindergarten next Fall either--this school offers a bridge class for him and he will go to that next yr. This school seems to be very understanding of the development of boys and of the individual child.
The director/principal of this school, was a public school principal for 30 yrs. His teacher has taught for that long as well. They are very patient, understanding and loving with my preschooler.
So if it were me, I would stand up for your ds and tell the teacher he is only 3, and you *wont* be doing homework with him!!!!!!!!! That is pretty sad.
My oldest ds (12 now) couldnt hold his pencil correctly even in the 1st grade. He sure couldnt write in cursive by 3rd grade. It all *clicked* for him in 4th grade. He also did not read for pleasure (he avoided it)until 4th grade! Let me tell you-- I had many disagreements with many inexperienced teachers who thought my ds should be able to just conform at the snap of their fingers. The best yrs he had were with *very* experienced, understanding teachers. I am not saying this will be the case with your ds--I am just pointing out to you that development doesnt happen at the exact same time for all kids. For example my middle ds was reading at the age of 4-1/2yrs and *always* read for pleasure and colored perfectly in the lines, could write his name by 3-1/2, etc... Big differences in each boy!
Good luck!
my three year old won't go to preschool until she is 4. I think she would enjoy preschool as far as playing with other kids, but we are not pushing her whatsoever. Not that we don't work with her, but we just encourage whatever she is interested in. Another thing is that she does not preform anything. If you say count to ten for me or something she usually doesn't want to, but we hear her saying them while she plays and stuff. It seems to work really well. She is learning as she should but it is not stressful on any of us and when she is 4 she can go into preschool developmentally ready do well and hopefully like school. That is our theory so far and it is working well for us.
My DD is in Kindergarten this year and they just started the letter "F" today. But, I was just talking to my SIL this weekend and her school system (in NY) wants the kindergarten classes reading by Dec. or Jan. She said that academic type pre-school is almost mandatory for her school system and she told me the kids were given homework in pre-school. Personally, I think that is crazy.
my dd is only 19mo old and while at the park one day playing , some of the mothers and i were talking about school and they were shocked i hadnt signed her up for some kind of class yet. i thought to myself for gods sake shes only 19months old! they were also talking about homework their toddlers have from preschool." homework?! " i said i was shocked.
mind u (slight brag here) she can recognize certain shapes/colors and can use sign lanugage very well but homework?
i agree with the mothers above when they said that at that age they should be enjoying themselves and have circle time and singing and playing with play-doh. ur child is only 3 and there will be plenty of time LATER for homework! 15 more years of homework to look forward to!! lol
p.s. dd now goes to a play group to play! and have fun once a week or so
This is not an appropriate place for him to be! It's not your son, it's the school! Get him out of there! I'm not kidding! (I'm a teacher- I've taught grades K-5)
I think a preschool should be mostly play! Emily's preschool did do a letter a week, but I don't remember any worksheets. When she was 3-1/2, she was interested in letters and I did show her how to write her name, but I can't imagine a preschool being like "real" school.
Their letter stuff was coloring a picture that represented the letter and attach it to the one from the week before. At the end of the year, they had a long catepillar made up of the letters of the alphabet.
(I'm a hungry little worm and if you'll play with me, I'll eat through the alphabet, all the way from A to Z) It was a cute little song that went over the alphabet. They got a cassette tape with the song at the end of the year.
This is not an appropriate place for him to be! It's not your son, it's the school! Get him out of there! I'm not kidding! (I'm a teacher- I've taught grades K-5)
I really am at a loss as to why you said this... Can you please explain?
I think maybe I need to clarify some things about my post (I'm almost wishing I hadn't said anything at this point because I feel I'm having to defend my choice in schools).
His school is half a preschool and half a daycare, they have a curiculum that is approved by the state. They don't do this part all day long, they play with toys, read stories, have centers, play on the playground, do artwork, show and tell, etc... I searched for months to find a place that I felt comfortable leaving him at (SAHM/student starting clincals) and felt and still feel comfortable in the place that I choose. It's within our payrange, all the teachers are college degreed, and so far I've had no problems. I did not want to leave him at a place where they had no structure and simply "played" all day, maybe I'm wrong in that but that's what we decided.
The reason I posted asking for suggestions was because he's having a hard time being "motivated" and I'm not sure how to make it a little more enjoyable for him and make him WANT to do his colorsheets. As for the "homework" I have no problem with helping him with something that he had a problem with at school so he can have a little more practice and one on one.
The worksheets that they are doing are the kind that have the letter and they find other lettters the same or color the pictures that start with the letter "F" frog, fish, etc... They aren't anything that is incredibly hard and I worked with these type of things with him in the past before starting his school.
You don't have to defend his school. Mine are 4 and we do the same thing- just not until January.
Don't push him- make it fun. Praise him, praise him.
If you are happy and he is too- that is most important.
Christy my son is 2 1/2 & I do these kind of work sheets with him at home.
I think that the school/daycare sounds like a wonderful thing & wish that I could get my ds into one like this. It sounds like they are not doing anything more than what a parent should be doing at home. I applaud your decision to find him a school like this.
I think that maybe give him a chance to get over being sick & hopefully he will get back into the swing of things. He wasn't having this problem before he was sick was he?
Thanks Emily, he had been having his good days and bad days. Usually 1 out of the 3 days a week he'd do REALLY good, another day he'd half way try and the other day he'd flat out refuse like he has all week this week.
Thanks for the encouragement I was feeling pretty down about all of this.
I actually quit teaching at a program where the director insisted that my 3's class do worksheets with numbers/letters on them. It was only about 1 hour out of 4 that we were expected to work with them on this-- the curriculum appeared to be Kindergarten. I told her I disagreed with that for 3's... This is just how I feel. If you dont feel this way that's ok!
I still wouldn't do *homework* with a 3 yo. (and I am not saying that in a mean or blunt voice, please understand that! lol) If I were talking to you in person you would hear a 'this is just what I did for my kids type voice'. You certainly have to do what you *you* feel is best for your own children. I wasnt trying to hurt your feelings from my post. I hope I didnt make you feel bad-- I guess I thought it might be encouraging to know that there are prescool's out there that hold off a bit on the academics. *most* 3 yo's dont quite have the motor skills developed yet that they need to do writing... sigh... I am so sorry if my post upset you, that sure wasnt my intent.
I actually know some Mommy friends that are teachers-- they are sahm's right now. They wont even give their young children coloring sheets-- they give them *blank* paper and let them create with paint or crayons. Now my ds *does* have coloring books!! lol But I thought it was pretty neat how they believed the way they did.
I probably shouldnt speak for Lauram--but I will. lol!! I think she meant that in a concerned way. I think she believes like alot of us that this work your ds is doing in his 3's class is inappropriate. It is more appropriate for 4's that is JMO... and thats *all* it is--an opinion. ;)
I know how you feel, because I have posted things before that I wished I wouldnt have. So like I said, I really was NOT trying to hurt your feelings or upset you.
Another thing I didnt see mentioned was you can play with shaving cream on the table with your ds. My kids always loved spraying a big pile of it in front of them and they would *build* mountains with it and practice trying to write the letters of their name. This is easier for a 3, than gripping and controlling a pencil.
We also use to use the sand and a finger or a stick.
Huge sidewalk chalk. My 4-1/2 yo loves to draw with the sidewalk chalk.
My kids did alot of sorting at 3. We had a sensory table in our living room, that openend up, and one week I would have it filled with rice and beans/and measuring cups, the next week I would pull it outside and fill it with sand / bury things in the sand for them to find, in the warmer months water or we would put ice cubes in (each child would get a spray bottle filled with colored water and spray the ice cube watching it melt). Lots of interesting ways to kill time at our house! lol Oh and I laminated their names on a decorative preschool name tag-- I would give them those wipe off markers and they could trace the letters of their names.
My youngest at 3 liked to cut up anything I would let him cut up, with help from me, he could do cut and paste type work sheets. We played a alot of Animal Bingo last yr, Memory game, shaving cream play, finger painting, sidewalk paints/chalk. I bought him wood puzzles that spell out his name-- but he didnt start playing with them until this Fall. He is just now spelling his name for me (@ 4-1/2), can count out all the letters and can tell me all the colors in the puzzle.
Also, read, read, read...
He walks up to my computer now and starts naming the letters on the keyboard. But he still isnt writing them and it doesnt bother me or his teacher...He does point out/name letters and numbers on signs driving down the road. He will probably be reading before he is writing. I am not sure if thats good or not?
I could go on and on with things we do or did with our guys, but i dont want to bore you. lol!
Anyway, maybe *something* in here will be something that you can try with your ds at home and it *might* be helpful. You probably already do alot of this.
Conni
I'm sorry that you feel you have to defend yourself with this post. You know your child better than anyone on the boards so you have to choose what is right for your little one.
I know for my son at 3 he wasn't ready to sit at a table and take instruction, so I choose to put him in a setting that didn't have any such demands. I can tell you that he is not behind in Kindergarten this year what so ever and he actually looks forward to his homework. We as parents always want the best for our kids, but please take the whole picture into consideration and allow him to choose if he is up to "homework" that night. It won't be fun for either of you if it is a daily struggle. Many ehugs with your decisions.
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