Our library just started up their story time again for the school year. Story time is held in a sunken area of the libary and afterwards a lot of kids stay and play with the learning toys, puzzles and puppets. Sometimes the parents let their children play in the area while they search for books. I think the general rule is that children 3 and under are not to be left unattended in this area. I never leave my girls unattended there (DD-4 and DD-2) unless I have to go retrieve my 2 year old who has gone to get a new puzzle or book. My oldest DD has started playing with a little girl whose mother is almost never around-she could be searching the adult section of the library but I can never see her from the play area. Anyways I never thought anything about it with any other kids, but she has been acting inappropriately for the library-running around, hitting other kids with puppets. Of course my oldest DD tries to follow and copy her, but since I have been sitting there I have talked to my DD immediately and ended the behavior. Usually, the other girl notices that my daughter is not following her any more and stops and comes to find my DD again. Anyways, my youngest DD-2 likes to do what her sister does but today it just wasn't safe to let her play with this girl-she was hitting her with puppets and then right in front of me pushed DD-2 and she fell down a large stair. Of course her mother was no where in sight-the other moms there just looked horrified. I immediately picked my youngest up who was crying and told my oldest we were leaving-NOW. When we got to the car I explained to my oldest DD that this girl hurt Gina today and I can not allow either of them to play with this girl anymore. I told her that I would introduce her to two little girls who are her same age next week instead. There is a woman that I talk to at the library sometimes that has four year old twins. Their mother is always with them in the play area and like me stays to interact with her kids. I know I can't choose my daughter's friends-but I just couldn't let this friendship continue. Any opinions, thoughts, ideas for what to do next, or what I should have done?

By Tonya on Tuesday, September 23, 2003 - 02:31 pm:

I would have found the other mother and talked to her about it. But since you didn't next week when you go I would say something to her about it. Tell her what her DD did and that you feel she needs to stay in the area and watch her child and if not then you will be talking to the people in the library about child safety.

By Dawnk777 on Tuesday, September 23, 2003 - 02:36 pm:

I would have been sooooo mad! That happened to my younger daughter at McDonalds once. The grandpa was in the room, but not paying too much attention to what the kids were doing. After she pushed my daughter down into the balls as my daughter was trying to climb out, I got up and told her she couldn't just push people for no reason. Grandpa left with her soon after.

I don't think I would want my kids playing with the little girl either, if they were the same ages. How annoying that mom doesn't keep an eye on her. I took my kids with me to the adult areas for many years! Of course, I was never there too long, since I really didn't have much time to read stuff for me, anyway.

Recently at our library, we found a 2yo wandering around by herself. As we are wondering what to do with her, the mother finally wanders up to the children's area (3rd floor). I had seen the 2yo get off the elevator on the first floor BY HERSELF! When mom finally came, she didn't even say thank you for keeping an eye on her kid. Good grief. Mom just yelled at the kid for wandering off.

By Susan10 on Tuesday, September 23, 2003 - 03:12 pm:

I kind of go for the "it takes a village" mentality. If I see a kid who's acting inappropriately, I'll just firmly say, "Don't push." Then I'll try to engage the kid in constructive behavior with my kids, like, "I'm going to read this book. Do you want to sit and listen with us?" If the mother is just leaving the kid, I guarantee you that talking to the mother will do no good. I think the kid needs some kind adults who care to help influence her in a positive way, because she's obviously not getting it from her mother. Maybe you'll be doing her a great kindness, and showing your own kids how to be compassionate.

I read an interview with a kid who was all messed up and in jail who said that all his life there wasn't an adult who was kind to him. Kids need good examples, and kindness from other adults. JMHO.

By Susan10 on Tuesday, September 23, 2003 - 04:32 pm:

I just re-read your post and my post. Maybe I'm wrong. I don't know. I probably would have left right away, too. It's just so sad to write off a kid so young, because she has a crummy mom. Maybe I'm too idealistic. Is the little girl so rotten that she seems irredeemable? I know you don't want your kids to have this bad influence, but is there some way she can not be excluded, while still protecting your children.?

By Insaneusmcwife on Tuesday, September 23, 2003 - 05:22 pm:

If it had been me I would have notified the librarian and found the mother and let her have it...Just because there are other mothers sitting there dosn't mean they should have to watch her child. But thats just me and when it comes to my childeren I am a little hot tempered. We were at a thrift store, ds was 3 and he was bit by a 4 year old. Luckily it didn't brake the skin...the mother was no where to be found and when she finally showed up to claim her child we had a screaming match and the Military police were called by the thrift store...The lady was cited. At 1 my son knew better than to bite! You would think a 4 year old would know better!

By Mommmie on Tuesday, September 23, 2003 - 05:33 pm:

I agree with Susan's first response. I'd gently correct the girl. Try to work with her. Give the child the benefit of the doubt. She is so young. Doesn't mean you have to schedule play dates with her. Just when you are around her at story time.

This kind of stuff will come up again and again. I try to never judge another mom. (Although I do get frustrated with them sometimes!!) You just never know the whole story.

By Kaye on Tuesday, September 23, 2003 - 07:06 pm:

I have to say that when I notice a child who is misbehaving and the parent is no where to be found I correct them. It is just the teacher in me, at least that is what I say to parents who give me that look. I am never mean, but I think one of our big problems with society is we only think we have to answer to one or two people and don't think about our impact on everyone. Now if I was continually having to correct this child and mom was no where to be found this would get old and yep I would move on. I think to this girl it is important to say hey that is not nice, that hurts gina, please don't do that again. Not meanly, just matter of fact, reengaging her in a more appropriate manner is a great idea after that. Some kids are just tough, they really don't mean to hurt, but pushing and such are a way to communicate, like saying "hey play with me" or I am cool, etc.

By Dana on Tuesday, September 23, 2003 - 08:12 pm:

Well, I would tell the child she has a two choices. She can follow the rules that your DD follows and play with DD or she can choose poor behavior and not be allowed around your children. Since the mom doesn't care, maybe the child will care and enjoy the guidence.

By Ginny~moderator on Tuesday, September 23, 2003 - 09:59 pm:

Since your children want to go to story time, and it is unlikely you will change this mother's behavior, I think you have two choices:

You can try to work with this child, speaking to her about her behavior and intervening when she behaves inappropriately - and tell her she is not allowed to play with your dd when she is misbehaving; or
You can speak to the librarian about the mother not being present and the child behaving inappropriately, and especially that your 2 year old could have been injured when she was pushed down the stairs, and suggest the librarian speak to the mother and tell her that since her daughter is not behaving appropriately she cannot be in the story group unless her mother is with her.

I would not speak to the mother myself. You have no "authority", and could just get into a "not my child" argument or worse. Once upon a time parents were embarassed when their children's misbehavior was brought to their attention (and many of us still are) but you can't count on that.

By Ginny~moderator on Tuesday, September 23, 2003 - 10:07 pm:

Your third choice, of course, is what you plan to do - introduce your 4 year old to the twins and have her play with them. I suspect, however, that this other child will still want to play with your dd and the problems will continue if you don't try to intervene or get her banned from the story group unless her mother is present.

By Mommyathome on Tuesday, September 23, 2003 - 10:16 pm:

I would report to the story hour person or the librarian that there is a problem with this child. Make a complaint. The librarian will them most likely confront the mother with the problem. Something like...
*we've had a complaint that your DD does not behave while playing w/the other children.

That way, you are not pulled into it and you and your DD's can still feel comfortable going to story hour.

By Jtw on Wednesday, September 24, 2003 - 12:28 am:

I would definitley let the library officials know. Is there a rule that the parents need to stay with their children? If not maybe you could suggest that they put up a notice, and that they should also say something to this other mother. I think a four year old is definitley too young to be hanging out alone in a public place. What if some molester or kidnapper noticed that no one was watching her and seized the opportunity? I know it is awful to think about, but you never know where creeps are. Kids have been kidnapped out of the parents car while they were returning shopping carts! It is not your, or the other parents responsibilty to watch her child, and it is unfair of her to expect everyone else to do it for her. I would definitley say something to the child if she did something inappropriate. My first priority is to protect my kids, so I have no problem correcting other children if their behavior is out of hand and the parent does nothing. I have lots of experience with this because we have 13 grandkids in our family, so it is impossible for each parent to watch each kids all the time. I agree with Susan, just say, "No pushing." and if she continues to do it explian to her that she can't play with your kids if she does it again. She is old enough to understand. I hope I don't sound like a big meanie, but sometimes kids need someone to be firm with them.

By Feona on Wednesday, September 24, 2003 - 05:48 am:

If I left my almost four year old alone in the library to look at books they librarian would call the cops.

By Fraggle on Wednesday, September 24, 2003 - 02:44 pm:

Thank you everyone for your comments. It is so nice to be able to get ideas and support from so many other moms.
I don't think I even would be able to confront the mother for several reasons, but even if I did I'm not sure it would do any good-she has witnessed her child running around and hitting kids with puppets before and has said nothing. Based on everyone's input I think I will go with my plan to have my oldest DD meet some other kids but let the other little girl join, too. And if we have any more incidents I will let her know that she can not play with my DD if the behavior continues. I hate to discipline other people's children-but I have in the past when it meant the safety of my own.
We will see how it goes next week !

By Lauram on Friday, September 26, 2003 - 04:58 pm:

I agree with the "it takes a village." I have no problem disciplining other kids-especially if the other mom is not around. I also think this could be neglect. I would definitely report this to the library staff. It is NOT appropriate to leave a four year old alone in a public building!

By Merno on Monday, September 29, 2003 - 04:48 pm:

I agree that you should correct the little girl, I do this myself. You have a right to protect your child. I doubt that apporaching the other mother would help...how could you let an almost 4 year old out of your sight? If correcting the girl yourself and trying to engage her in more approriate behavior, then the librarian is the next step.

Certainly introduce your daughter to the other children

By Tammylynn on Tuesday, September 30, 2003 - 09:50 am:

Sometimes I am honestly amazed at what I see other children getting away with. And that is with a parent right there watching. It seems like society has made me a nervous wreck. I am becoming so over protective of my kids. I wonder which is worse, letting them learn by doing and possibly getting hurt or keeping them sheltered and unable to experience new things.

As far as this situation, I would almost feel obligated as a parent to try and discipline and "keep an eye" on this child. But on the other hand, it is not my responsibility. I have my own children to raise. But in the end, I think my best bet would be to keep my children away from this other kid, but at the same time keep her in my sites. It is obvious her mother could care less what she is doing!!

By Mommymindy on Friday, October 3, 2003 - 10:48 am:

This is such a touchy subject! If you do say something to the other mom, she may get defensive. I have had problems with my children trying to mimmick the actions of other children, and I suspect it won't be the only time that I have this problem in their lives!!! Usually I just do what I know is right. If I know that this parent is being neglectful or ignoring what her children are doing, I will just take charge. When you say to your daughter "no, that's not nice" You say the same to the other woman's child. If her mom isn't around like you say, you don't have to worry about that confrontation of "don't tell my child what to do". Don't worry about it not being your place to tell them anything, it is your place if it's affecting your daughters behavior! I have found that children listen to other people much better than their own parents! It's sad but true!