ADD
Moms View Message Board: Parenting Children with Special Needs: ADD
Well, you'd think I'd know all about this, but I feel totally lost! We're having Randy evaluated for ADD, inattentive type. Robin's ADHHHHHHHHD, so I know all about that! lol Randy basically failed the 6th grade and is having to go to summer school for science and social studies. He's a smart kid and never should have failed to begin with. His final report card with all four quarters on it had his grades all over the alphabet! He'd have an A or B one quarter and a D or F the next, then back to a B or C the next. All his teachers agree he's capable. He got mostly A's and B's on the work he did turn in. It was all the work he DIDN'T turn in that got him. We had an IEP meeting on Friday because he was graduating from speech and needing an IEP (totally ready for it--his speech has improved tremendously!). They asked if I had any concerns and I said, yeah! He's totally unorganized! I then said I'd been asking his teachers since 1st grade if he could be ADHD and they've always said, no--he's just social. His homeroom teacher piped up, "I'd be shocked if he WEREN'T ADD." She said unless she takes him out in the hall and gets his totally attention, right in his face, he doesn't hear her or know what needs to be done. She also said he had a terrible time getting things done in the classroom when it wasn't absolutely silent. He's not hyper (usually! lol). She did say socially he does wonderfully! She said typically with 6th graders the kids go through periods when they change friends weekly with their moods. She said Randy's pretty much had the same group of friends all year long. Everyone pretty much loves him, including the teachers and adults. Everyone always has.
So I feel totally lost. I'm used to the "H" in there! lol I did talk to a friend that's an OT who also teaches Randy's Sunday School class at least once a month and asked her her opinion. She said she could see it and getting his checked out wouldn't hurt anything. He can definately focus when he wants to, but mostly one on one or in small groups (karate, guitar, skateboarding, video games, etc). I've emailed all his teachers to try and get the form the ped clinic gave me filled out before they bolt for the summer. lol We'll see what happens.
Nope, never boring in our house... 
They are actually all called ADHD. It sounds like what you are referring to is ADHD, inattentive type. I would make sure you have a "full eval" done to rule out LD. Also look into CAPD. Many times, ADHD is used as a "catch-all" phrase, but isn't necessarily the root of the problem. How's he doing emotionally? How does he handle things at home? Also research executive functioning. My son has these issues big time!
I do remember reading that it's all "ADHD" now, but old habits die hard.  I had to look up CAPD, but from what I read I don't think that's Randy's problem. He did have speech problems, but they are all completely resolved now (he scored 100% on the speech test the SLP did). There were some big gaps in his test scores that I hadn't noticed until this past weekend. He's still in the average-high average range, but with some scores being in the 90's and others up to 134, I think I'll still address it. Emotionally he's doing great. He's always been a pretty mellow kid. He does have his emotional moments, but they're actually becoming fewer. Of course, he can sass with the best of them, but he'll be 12 next month and puberty is quickly approaching (oh, JOY!). Here at home he's very forgetful. Like today--this morning I told him he needed to pick up his dirty laundry (daily reminders, although the hamper sits right there in plain sight--I do have to say that's usually all that's on his floor). It didn't happen until he asked if the neighbor could spend the night and I told him if he wanted him to he'd have to go pick up his dirty laundry right then. Also, he wanted to go over there this morning and I told him to be home for lunch at 11:30. At 12:15 Robin had to go over there and get him. He said he was in his friend's room playing and there's not a clock in there and he just lost track of time. He does that a lot. I'll have to look executive functioning.
One of the five teachers I emailed responded about the questionair.  I was hoping for a better response. At least the one that did respond will be teaching 7th grade next year so he may have her and she knows him and knows what's going on. So frustrating.
Thanx for your input, Laura. Between the two of us, we should get together and write a book! lol There are a few others on here that could contribute a lot, also.
Cat,
My 13 year old 8th grader was just diagnosed with the same thing about 2 weeks ago. Her situation is very similar to what you have posted about your son. She is very unorgainzed and her grades can be all B+ - A 's one semester and then she can have A, B, C , D the next. I am very frustrated with the school system because dh and I have asked and asked and asked since 2nd grade why she can do well on homework and projects (although these things will take ALOT of time to complete) and just absoultely bomb a test. Their standard answer has been "some kids just don't test well". After her diagnosis I have asked the teacher to let me know if they see any difference in her attention/focus as we have stared some low dosage medicaction. The few that bothered to respond said NO---H has always had trouble focusing and I have to move her to the hallway by herself for her to get anything done. WHAT???? There are 7 school days left and they NEVER mentioned this during any of the parent teacher conferences. GRRRRRR
Tammie, Randy doesn't actually bomb the tests. Well, maybe one or two. In social studies for the year he got a B, F, A, F for the four quarters. In science he got B, F, F, C. Huh? How can this not raise some flags??? It really is a pain, isn't it? I hope you dd does better next year. Did she start on a med? Which one? I'm still debating if this is ADHD whether or not to go the med route for Randy. I guess we'll have to wait and see. Hugs
I am going through this with my youngest, and she is on meds but you have to also do some kind of therapy so they can learn how to be organized. We are really struggling with that. She makes all As on the tests and doesn't do or turn in her homework at all, which in 4th grade means she has mostly Bs. The school is no help, especially since she got commended on all the TAKS tests (state exams), so I am reading books trying to find a way to teach her how to be organized, if you come up with anything else on that let us know.. I am running out of options.
We are still trying to get the med thing totally right, and when I think we have it right she hits a big growth spirt and we start all over.
Hugs...
There were some big gaps in his test scores that I hadn't noticed until this past weekend. He's still in the average-high average range, but with some scores being in the 90's and others up to 134,
This raises some red flags for me- especially if it's effecting his academics- which it sounds like it is. Who is doing the eval? The school? Whoever it is, point this out. It's important.
Someday I'll write that book! When I get that "free moment!" Hahaha!
I got three questionaires back this morning. I didn't get one from a teacher that actually said she was going to fill it out! I guess I can cut her some slack, though. She's been pretty sick this week (they think she has mono) and she's getting married in two weeks and supposed to leave the country for her honeymoon. She's got a lot on her plate right now! I'm happy with three. I'll drop them off next week and get an appointment scheduled.
Tarable, the med game sucks, doesn't it? Robin hasn't hit any big growth spurts lately, but we're still working on adjusting his meds. He seems to become immune after a while. I'm thinking he needs to go back on something for his ADHD. He can only work for about 15 minutes at a time. He's not getting ANYTHING done! It's so frustrating.
Laura, the school does the eval. The resource teacher administered the Woodcock-Johnson in January of 2006. His scores were broad reading-99, broad math-122 and broad written language-100. The other test was the Kaufman Assessment Battery for Children II (I've never heard of this one), administered by the school psychologist. His scores on this one were sequential/Gsm-134, simultaneous/Gv-114, learning/Glr-97, planning/Gf-96 and knowledge/Gc-95. Don't ask me what half that means because I have no clue! I haven't looked that one up. I guess I'll be talking to special services when school starts. Good thing is, I know the guy in charge because of all our dealing with Robin! Hey, it pays to have a foot in the door.
You let me know when you get that free moment. I can guarentee we'll never have free moments at the same time! lol
Looks like it could be LD/ADHD. Is he already identified as learning disabled (reading?) It also looks like he has executive functioning issues. (Note- I am NOT trained in reading scores- but there is huge scatter. That's a big red flag). Look up executive functioning and see what you think.
His IEP was for speech. He doesn't have a problem with reading, although he wasn't reading on grade level until the end of 2nd grade (started the year over 1 year behind, finished OGL). The speech effected his spelling, but that's not an issue anymore. I looked at executive functioning and it didn't look like it fit. I guess we'll see what the ped's clinc comes up with. I do know there could be a problem with the gap in scores. I just don't know what it is.
You don't really worry about gaps in his scores on a single test. LD is identified by a big gap in the IQ test and the achievement test. But each kid can be very strong in some areas and weak in others. Both the woodcock and the johnson are IQ test.
If I were to make a cold test, I would say they were redoing the IQ testing to try to find an area he can qualify for LD. There has to be 2 standard deviations which for most IQ test is about 24 points in difference.
Without the paperwork in front of me, I would assume that the typical child is about 100, a gifted child range falls between 125- and up, a mental retarded student falls below 70, but in general most scores should fall between 90-110. sequential/Gsm-134(this is short term memory, appears he is "gifted" in the area), simultaneous/Gv-114 (this is visual processing, appears he is slightly above average), learning/Glr-97 (long term storage and retrieval, he appears to be average), planning/Gf-96 (this is fluid reasoning/logic, he appears to be average) and knowledge/Gc-95 (this is called crystalized ability...not sure exactly what that means, but your son appears average).
Hope that helps some.
We have an appointment with the ped for an eval the 29th. I'm finding with Randy's summer school homework the mistakes he's making are minor things, like putting the answer for #3 on the line for #4 and mixing up east and west. It's that attention thing. We're all learning something from summer school! At least he's doing well so far. He's getting B's in both classes.
hey cat not to steal your post but... i have had teachers comment it's possible brad could be add as well. argh!! AND get this...I am thinking that Brandon actually is bi-polar and has been misdiagnosed as adhd/conduct disorder. aaaaaaahhhhhhhh
I need valium. lol
Good luck with your eval! Keep us posted.
Oh, Conni. Girl, big hugs. (I almost typed "bug" hugs! rofl) Is your x going to have Brandon re-evaluated? What meds is he on? Why did it take until 6th and 7th grade for our boys teachers and us to figure out they may be ADD??? Ugh.
I was talking to someone today about things I'm finding in Randy's summer school homework. Little mistakes like putting the answer to #3 on the line for #4 and mixing up east and west. She's a SPED teacher (resource) and asked if we'd looked into visual processing disorder. Nope, haven't looked that one up! What she was saying makes sense because it did take Randy forever to learn left from right. I'll look it up. Not tonight. I'm tired and there's a puppy that won't stop licking my foot!!! lol We'll see...
Randy had his appointment the 29th. The doc thinks that given the info on the questionaires (got four from teachers and dh's and mine) Randy had ADHD, inattentive. She said he needed 6 of 9 markers and he had 8. So we have an rx for concerta, starting at the smallest dose for a week, bumping up to the middle dose for a week and then the highest dose for a week, and then we'll see which works best. We also talked about things he'll have to do at school to make sure he's getting what he needs there. Things like making sure his planner is filled out EVERY day, he brings all the books home he needs for his homework, where to sit in the classsroom, etc. He won't start the medicine until school starts--IF I decide to give it to him. I haven't decided yet. We'll see when it gets closer (well, they start August 6th). Just updating.
Oh, he passes summer school. He got B's in both classes.
Cat- I was just reading that bit about the # 3 and #4 and the east and west. That doesn't sound like attention to me.... Look at his WISC and see if you see any low numbers in that arena.
Cat if you are considering medicating him, it might not be a bad idea to figure out what works before school starts. My little guy has had a heck of a time with meds, they make him a new kid in a good way, but he has had bad reactions to several meds now. We are just about to start a new med in august to see if we can get him ready before school.
We go to Vegas next Wednesday and get back the following Wednesday. If we start the meds on the Monday after that we can try one week at home, then school starts Aug 6th. Dh thinks we should do that, too. *sigh* I just don't know. Part of me thinks meds could help Randy concentrate, and another part of me thinks he doesn't need them--he just needs to work harder and pay attention! Then I think *that's what the meds will help him do*! Argh!!! I'm not ready for summer break to be over, either. Stop the world, I want off.
Okay, school starts next Monday. We decided to try the concerta this week so he wouldn't be starting the first day of school. BOY is that child moody!!!!! He's wheepy, too, like he's on the verge of tears all the time. I asked him "Are you moody-er than normal?" He said yes, and his stomach hurts. So now he doesn't want to eat, even though he didn't eat lunch. He wanted something from Sonic after we saw the chiropractor this morning (I thought he'd broken his elbow, but it's just a bad bruise), but he and Robin were fighting really bad so I said no to Sonic for both of them (that's a treat and they certainly didn't earn it). If the concerta's going to make him a grouchy little bear he'll just have to try harder at school--a LOT harder! We know from summer school he can succeed if I stay on him EVERY night, but as a 7th grader I shouldn't need to do that with him. I may have to, though, until he can get his act together and do it himself. Football starts a week after school does and he really wants to play. They'll put him on athletic suspension if his grades drop, so that's an incentive. I just don't like my easy-going, mellow little guy being so grouchy and wheepy. Medicating him, imho, isn't worth that. I'll talk to dh and Randy tonight and we'll decide what to do. We may try one more day just to see if it's something he has to adjust to. So far, though, after only about 1/2 a day, I don't like this at all and neither does Randy.
Ok, keep in mind that I'm not in your position and haven't had to medicate my son (yet) but my dh has been dxed with adult ADD and it took about two weeks for the side effects to balance out. The first week he was irritable and sleepy, had no appetite and it didn't seem to help extend his attention span. After a couple of weeks, all the side effects were gone except for his lack of appetite. I just wonder if his body would adjust to the new medication and level out after a short period of time on it. Good luck! I hope something works out for both of you.
When my oldest started concerta she did the same thing, but by the 3rd or 4th day she had gotten used to it and doesn't have those issues anymore. Also I don't know what the dr told you about Concerta but if he is not eating in the day try to get him to eat something later in the evening (about 12 hrs after he took it that morning.) My DD is starving about 8 or 9 because that is when the med start to wear off. Good luck. If I were you I would try to give it a few days to see if the side effects balance out.
We decided to give it some more time to see if the side effects wear off. Although the little monkey didn't get up until almost noon today so he didn't get his medicine until noon! I hope he's not up too late tonight! lol He's back in his room playing video games now. The neighbor kid he likes to play with doesn't make it out until usually 2ish (he likes to sleep late, too) so Randy will probably head outside then. He was in a good mood this morning (well, this-noon!). I'll keep you updated.
Cat- Be careful. Especially with your family history. There can be adverse reactions with kids with undxed bp and stimulants. I'd call the dr.
There are other choices besides stimulants. Strattera is one- though it didn't do squat for my ds. My ds now takes Wellbutrin. (He takes it for depression, but there is also an added benefit for the ADHD.)
I found this article, but there are many....
Diagnosis and treatment of bipolar disorder
Author Kay Redfield Jamison details what is known, and what psychologists are still learning, about bipolar illness.
BY KEN KREHBIEL
Recently an 8-year-old boy diagnosed with attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder was put on stimulants. Soon afterward the child--whose mother and father both have bipolar disorder--became acutely agitated and hanged himself.
"There are few things worse than putting a child with bipolar illness on stimulants," said Kay Redfield Jamison, PhD, who told the story at "Serious emotional disturbance--new directions for the millennium" at APA's 2000 Annual Convention in Washington, D.C., Aug. 48.
Jamison, professor of psychiatry at Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine and author of "An Unquiet Mind: A Memoir of Moods and Madness" and "Night Falls Fast: Understanding Suicide," detailed what is known, and what psychologists are still learning, about bipolar illness. She is particularly concerned about today's treatment and diagnosis of bipolar disorder.
According to Jamison, gathering a patient's family history is extremely important in deriving the right diagnosis, but as the story of the 8-year-old boy illustrates, it is still sometimes neglected. Because manic depression has a very strong genetic component, she said, "it is important to take a very thorough family history of mood disorder and suicide, in addition to inquiring about mood lability, irritability, euphoria, history of euphoria, hypersexuality and grandiosity--in other words the classic symptoms of mania, racing of thoughts, lessening of sleep. Some of these things seem very straightforward, but it's amazing how many people don't ask them of kids before they just put kids on Ritalin."
Thanx for the info and concern, Laura. The thought has crossed my mind, and I'm keeping a close eye on Randy. Robin's first rage was caused by Adderal XR. It was horrible and I took him off it immediately. Randy did have a bad dream last night, which doesn't happen very often. He was so cute! He knocked on our door at about 4:30 this morning and when dh answered it Randy said, "This may sound childish, but I had a bad dream and am scared." Dh asked him if he wanted to come lay in our bed for a while and he did. I don't know if he was just overtired or if the meds may have somehow caused this dream. He went back to sleep, though. Randy does have some of the early symptoms of bipolar, especially the separation anxiety and lack of sleeping as a baby/toddler. He got over both, though by the time he was about 3 1/2yo, and hasn't shown any signs since then. He's always been easy going and pretty mellow. He's our funny child. He can also be extremely sarcastic, though. He comes by it naturally, though.
Like I said, I'm keeping a close eye on him. If anything seems amiss I'll call his doctor ASAP. I can always call Robin's pdoc or therapist, too. I'm not glad I already have an "in" to that world, but it is there if I need it. Thanx again.
Phew. I'm glad you know about that already.
I had to laugh- both my kids had nightmares last night, too. Very atypical for them as well.
Hi Ladies,
I have read most of your postings, and I think I can relate to most of what has been posted.
My son was diagnosed a low/moderate ADD when he was in kindergarten after showing classic signs of difficulty in the classroom. He is now in the 7th grade, and the process over the years for getting him assistance in school has been challenging to say the least. And the frustration and tears that go with it... We have continued year after year to get calls from teachers expressing the same concerns with comprehension, learning, staying on task, focusing. His greatest areas of difficulty are in staying focused for extended periods of time and processing of information. He is also very well mannered, sweet and extremely polite. On the quiet side. This past year, he spent 4-6 hours a night doing homework, and then would get up early in the morning to finish what didnt' get done the night before. He maintains pretty good grades, but he works so so hard to do it. It is too much, and we have already made it clear that the long homework nights are night going to happen again this year. My son tends to be OCD. As with many of you, we have seen the grades fluctuate greatly from one grading period to the next. With the public school, his learning problems do not hit their radar, so getting the assistance he needs has been extrememly difficult. I avoided medications until recently, opting to focus on nutrition, suplements and behavior modification. We are now trying some of the medications, but so far we are not seeing any difference. Tried Adhoral first, but that left him feeling very emotional and weepy. Also, there were no signs of improvement. We are now trying concerta and have just increased the dose.
I am looking into some resources to use at home to help him with reading/comprehension. Is anyone familiar with text-to-speech software, or gone through RFBD (Reading for Blind/Dyslexic) for learning materials? Do you have any recommendations?
Also, can you tell me what CAPD and OT mean?
Thanks
Hi, Suzie and if I missed your intro (very possible--I don't check the New board very often) Welcome!
CAPD-Central Auditory Processing Disorder
OT-Occupational Therapy
I have to give your son (and you) credit for his perseverance. Four to six hours of homework a night?!? I'd have been in the school telling them, "No way!" I don't even know high school students that have that on a regular basis. I totally understand, though, if he has OCD tendencies. I have one with that issue. With him, however if he doesn't feel he can do it perfectly he won't even try and he'll shut down.
We tried Concerta for a couple of weeks with my younger son. Although it helped him focus he wasn't eating (had no appetite) and wasn't able to get to sleep until midnight and had to be up again at 6 the next morning. He'd wake up starving (from not eating the day before), eat a huge breakfast with his meds and then not want to eat the rest of the day. I also thought it made him a bit hyper which isn't normal for him. He's usually pretty mellow. He just has trouble focusing. So we've now switched to strattera. He started at 18mg (I think) for a week and has now switched to 50mg. We haven't noticed any change with the strattera. He says it doesn't help him focus at all. I was told it may take 2-4 weeks to see improvement, so we're still waiting. Although I'm a bad mommy and forgot to give it to him this morning. :D He is eating again though and back to a normal sleep schedule.
My older son is ADHD and bipolar. He's not on any meds for the ADHD right now. He's also homeschooled because he couldn't function in public school. He was constantly in trouble. If it wasn't for acting up, it was for just sitting and doing nothing. There was no pleasing his teachers. I went round and round with them and in the end the local district failed him miserably. He has slight hearing loss in one ear due to several surgeries (scar tissue) and we also think he has a processing speed problem, but nothing was ever formally diagnosed with that. By the time we suspected that we'd had enough and already decided to pull him out.
I've never heard of RFBD and have no experience with test-to-speech software, but have heard of it. I don't know anything about it, though. With a dx of ADHD/ADD your son should be able to get some help from the school. It will be difficult if they don't feel it's effecting his education, but not impossible. Unfortunately you'll probably have to look for a small loophole or something to get him help. That or wait until he starts failing. It's too bad the public school system doesn't seem to have the kid's best interest at heart. You'd think that's what they'd be all about. You'll have to excuse me if I seem a bit bitter. It's been a long hard road for us with my oldest and I have lots of issues with the public school system in general. Good luck and let us know how it's going from time to time.
Hi Suzie,
I have 2 dds both dx of ADHD and both are on meds. my oldest who is super hyper is on Concert 36 mg and it works like a charm and has from day one. My younger dd is now on focalin xr and I am not sure that is what she will stay on. She (Jordan) has a lot of trouble focusing on on thing too hard so she doesn't keep up with what the rest of the class is doing. I can't seem to get any help from the teachers because she passes without trying and not turning in most of her homework. They don't seem to want to help unless she is not going to pass the state exams (TAKS) in texas. Everyone that I have talked to here and other places says the only way to get them to help if your child isn't failing is to find out all the state rules and hold that over there heads saying i contacted you here and it says you must evaluate by this date and such.
Good luck with your son and if you ever need to talk we are here and my email is tarable 2 at gmail dot com.
Hi Cat,
Hi Tarable,
Thank you both for your responses. It's nice to be able to have other mom's to share/talk to about all of this.
The OCD issue had not even occurred to me until this past May. Actually, my oldest daughter half jokingly commented that we needed to lighten up with our son or we were going to make him OCD. He had just finished spending an hour and a half doing dishes (most of which had already been done for him) and then another 45 minutes in the bathroom brushing his teeth and washing his face. I have been attributing all of his behaviors to ADD, but now, I am not so sure. I am looking form some good books to read for us on OCD and how we can help our son with some coping mechanisms. If you come across any good ones, I would love to know what you have found.
Recording for the Blind and Dyslexic (RFBD) is something a couple of his teachers have suggested to me to help with reading and comprehension. I am still looking into it. Their website is www.rfbd.org if you are interested in checking it out. They have an extensive library of audio textbooks and reading books. I did some checking this week, and they have all of my son's textbooks and additional reading books available on audio that he will need for the year. I think we will probably sign up. With four kids, the amount of time I have to read to him or with him is limited. I need for him to be able to work independently. There are some startup/membership expenses involved, but once you are a member, the annual renewal is minimal, and you get up to 35 free rentals a year, which would more than cover what my son needs for school.
Also, the information you have posted on side affects of the Concerta has been helpful. My son has had some trouble sleeping this week after increasing his dosage, but hopefully that will subside in another week or so. He has not had any decrease in appetite.
Thanks again. Have a super weekend.
Susan
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